Today on the More Cheese Less Whiskers podcast we're talking with Milan Krueger from New Zealand.

Milan has a very special program where he's helping people in New Zealand, young men, 18 to 35 years old who have between 30 and 80 pounds to lose.

That's a specific group, and you'll see as we go through the conversation how we arrived at that very specific articulation of his target audience.

It's great to see that thinking come together. He's had a lot of success and enthusiasm for helping people. In fact, he lost 80 pounds himself and that was a big part in sparking his passion for helping people, young men in New Zealand, do the same thing.

We had a great conversation about the entire 'Before Unit'. About how to set his program up, and how to think about all the profit activators that act together to identify his audience, to get people to raise their hand, to educate and motivate them, and then to make offers so they are ready to get the help he can provide.

Show Links:
ProfitActivatorScore.com
BreakthroughDNA.com
EmailMastery.com

Want to be a guest on the show? Simply follow the 'Be a Guest' link on the left & I'll be in touch.

Download a free copy of the Breakthrough DNA book all about the 8 Profit Activators we talk about here on More Cheese, Less Whiskers...

 

Transcript - More Cheese Less Whiskers 136

Dean: Hello. Milan.

Milan: Ah, Dean. How are you?

Dean: I'm so good. How are you?

Milan: Very good. Thanks. Wow, what an honor, eh? This is just a dream come true.

Dean: Tell me, where are you? You're afar, aren't you? You're in New Zealand.

Milan: Yes. I am actually. It's early morning 6:00 AM where I am right now, in beautiful New Zealand, yes.

Dean: Wow. So it's 6:00 tomorrow is what it is.

Milan: Yes, yes, it's actually ahead. Yeah, it's ahead of time.

Dean: Wow. Talk about the early birds. You really are the early birds.

Milan: Yeah, I'm definitely the early bird. Hoping to catch the worm as well.

Dean: Awesome. I'm so excited, we've got a whole hour here to hatch some evil schemes and do whatever we want.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Why don't you fill us in on the whole Milan story?

Milan: Sure.

Dean: Then we can jump off from there.

Milan: Get into it. Yeah, all right. I'm happy to. Just first off, thank you so much, Dean, for just doing what you're doing here like investing time back into young entrepreneurs like myself and so forth. Honestly, I just really wanted to say that it is first of off the bat, it's like a massive honor and a privilege, like knowing the stature of you and the people you talk with, it's insane. So firstly, thank you.

Dean: Thank you so much.

Milan: No worries. Yeah, the Milan story, let's quickly run through it. So the whole reason I actually started Kingdom Fitness and anything of the nature was that I just woke up one day and I was really not happy with what I saw in the mirror in terms of my own physical body. I was frustrated basically in my own body.

Enough so that I actually started losing weight. My best friend actually coached me through it at the time. Fast forward a little bit, it took me about 20 months, lost 81 pounds. I was in the best shape of my life. To this day, I'm obviously working on it.

Dean: What was the timeline again? You lost how many pounds in how many months?

Milan: 81 pounds in 20 months.

Dean: 81 pounds in 20 months. That's great.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, thank you, no. The reason I think it's, because you hear a lot of crash diets and so forth is because I feel like a lot of people lose weight the wrong way. But long story short, I actually used that to then I was inspired by it. I listened to actually you and Joe Polish who was recommended by my best friend as well, talking about just marketing and starting up companies, just doing it. I thought to myself, what skills do I have that I know I can really help people with and inspire other people and so forth?

I actually started Kingdom Fitness. I decided that I can actually inspire people and also solve a big problem in their lives which is them not feeling good about themselves or with their body. Fast forward a little bit, I've now started it up last year, August. I've done, I've had a few clients through the door that I'm still working with actively. Yeah, I'm at the stage now where I've got a few things going on the side. I'm ready to dive into marketing properly. So yeah, it's been a very interesting great growing stage for me.

But it is also a very unknown area because I haven't done proper marketing yet which is growth, exciting for me. I see it as a big challenge. Yeah, this is where we're at now currently. Yeah.

Dean: Awesome. What was your top weight when you lost the 81 pounds?

Milan: Well, so I started off on a hundred. I'll have to quickly convert it for you.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: I started off on 125 kg to, let me do it in pounds quickly for you. That is 275 pounds.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: That's what I started off as.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Minus 81 pounds of that obviously brings it down to yeah, is where I'm around about now. Yeah.

Dean: That's awesome. So the 190s, good for you.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: What was your approach to it then?

Milan: Yeah. This is a great question actually. Thank you. The thing is when I first started, it's actually real interesting that you ask that. When I first got going with my best mate and he started, he was a very big inspiration for me to do this is that he said to me, "Milan, it's going to take you about two years to lose the weight you want to do, if you're going to do it right."

Dean: Right.

Milan: At the time, for me, because I didn't know much about it which is how a lot of people are, they don't really know until they know. I was in this reactive state of, I was very, very sad. I burst out into tears and literally went home and cried at night because I thought, "Two years of my life is so long, but looking back, that was probably some of the best two years of my life that I spent in what I did."

Dean: Well, how old were you? How old were you when you started?

Milan: I was probably about 20, yes, about 20, lost the weight when I was about, yeah, 20 all the way through to about 22.

Dean: Okay, wow. So you didn't gain the weight all of a sudden. Were you heavy all the way through?

Milan: No, yes. See, this is the thing, yes. Yes. The way I've done that is, and this is what I'm trying to push with my whole business as well is that I lost the weight through proper dieting and basically changing my lifestyle versus drinking like a quick milkshake or a quick something to lose a few pounds and then just put it back up. So I was doing it with weight training and proper dieting, through the whole thing. I suppose that's probably why you look back and you'd be like, "20 months," it is long. I mean 80 pounds is quite a lot of weight, but it's still 20 months.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: I think the thing, yeah, it was more of a slow, gradual decline that allowed me to keep the weight off as well when I actually lost it in the end.

Dean: Of course, yeah.

Milan: Yeah, doing well, I think, which is great. That's why maybe I could inspire other people to do that is why I actually started all.

Dean: It's so funny, I had a friend who years ago, maybe it's over 20 years ago now, he lost about, let's see, he got up to 235, he weighs 180 now, so he lost about-

Milan: About 50.

Dean: 50 pounds, yeah, he lost about 50 pounds.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: What he's done to keep himself at that weight for over 20 years now is he weighs himself every day.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If he is 180 or 179 or 178, green light is what he gives himself, so he could eat whatever he wants, so he wants to have dessert or have ice cream or whatever. If he's 181 or 180, 181, the yellow light, just kind of watch it. Then if he gets to 182, he's red light. He stays on red light all the way 'til he gets back 178.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: He's kept himself in that five-pound band for 20 years by having that policy. He's never going to weigh more than 182 pounds.

Milan: Wow. That sounds a lot like Tony Robbins, he does that, something similar.

Dean: That is very interesting, right?

Milan: That is very interesting.

Dean: That that's something that he never has to lose 50 pounds again. He's only got to ever lose five.

Milan: Wow. I'm actually working on something very similar which is really interesting. I'm actually trying to do that with my own body at the moment is I'm trying to do exactly that, to get to my ideal because I don't want to become a body builder or a power lifter. I just want to feel and look good. So I just want to stay within like, like you said, five pounds up and down. Sort of when you want to hit the ideal weight. So yeah, that's real interesting. I think it's a real cool approach.

Dean: Yeah. It's interesting because I think that what happens is I think when you're weighing yourself, a lot of people say, "Well, you shouldn't weigh yourself. Don't pay any attention to the scale," because they feel that might be discouraging for you. But it feels like the scale is what makes it real, is that shows your brain that you're paying attention to it I think.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If you're-

Milan: I think it keeps you honest, eh.

Dean: I think that's it. If your intention is to lose weight, that you're not going to weigh yourself every day for a week and not have lost anything, do you know what I mean?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If that's true, then you're doing something wrong.

Milan: I think it's a real interesting one specifically. I do agree. I agree both ways. I actually have a friend who is doing the whole weight loss thing as well. He likes weighing himself every week. I spoke to him, so when I initially take on clients, I tell them to weigh themselves every month because I know how psychological the scale actually is.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: It plays on your mind. Like you mentioned, some people would weight themselves every day. That I think is unhealthy because you'd wake up every day, especially at the start, hear me out. This is when you start off.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: Because what will happen is you might do it for one week and be like, "Wow, I've lost maybe nothing." Where you need to give your body and metabolism time to adjust to what you're doing.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Then once you've done that, it starts. The weight will drop, but it's basically to keep you mentally strong. I suppose it's who you are and where you're at with your weight loss. I like to weight myself weekly as well.

Dean: What would you say is like, if you look at your, I guess most people talk about maybe losing a pound a week is about, that's the pace that you basically did, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Would you say?

Milan: I would say that's healthy. Yeah, I'd say that's healthy. Look, man, I'm very passionate about this, Dean, is that there are real bad ways to lose weight, honestly.

Dean: Yeah. Yeah.

Milan: I really do believe that. The problem is that those are the ones at the moment that are yelling the loudest, the ones that are having people flock. They lose 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 pounds in three months.

Dean: Yeah, because everybody wants to do it instantly.

Milan: Yes, exactly.

Dean: We're used to it that in every other way, you have this exponential opportunity that we're conditioned that there's an app for that. I mean literally, anything you can do online, you can push a button and have anything delivered right to your door.

Milan: I agree.

Dean: But you can't push an app to have somebody do your push-ups or eat the right food.

Milan: Yeah, exactly.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Exactly. Yeah, a lot of guys and stuff, they say it's honest work. That's why it's so hard to get the good physique is it's honest.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Yeah, that's what I'm trying to teach. I love it. Yeah, that's really good, definitely.

Dean: You can't fake a six-pack, that's true.

Milan: No, you can't. You can't. You can't fake a good body, that's right. Love it, eh. It's good stuff. I think for me, it's something very dear to my heart is to help people and inspire people to lose weight the right way and make it a lifestyle change rather than a this is going to end rather. Give them another option, like the third option if I put it that way.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because I think the big misconception is that when people go into weight loss in general is that they're like, "Okay. Now, my life is doomed to green smoothies and chicken breasts." Which is so-

Dean: Right, broccoli and chicken breasts, yeah.

Milan: Yeah, which is so far from the truth really.

Dean: Right.

Milan: Yes, of course, you're going to have to make some eating adjustments like naturally. I have a cheat meal almost weekly, that means something I can eat whatever I want, Dean. My cheat meals are legendary amongst my friends. The other day, I was forming a cheat day where I did 10,000 calories in one day. So-

Dean: Wow, that's something.

Milan: Yeah. There is definitely a third option if I put it that way. You can still enjoy your life but you can actually change it for the best. I believe so. Yeah. Really this is why I formed the company.

Dean: What's your approach then? If we say if we're describing how you work with people, let's talk about the business of what you're doing, how do you work with people? What is your during unit here? If somebody comes to you and says, "I really want to lose weight." Who are you looking for and how do you help them?

Milan: Cool. All right. Great. People I'd be looking for, this is a real interesting one as well. I hear you always talk about this as well, is that you have to really know your target market.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: When I started this off initially, I was like, because I'm a guy, I know how to lose weight for guys. I was like, okay. But even within that framework, I realized in the last month or so that there has to be, I have to narrow it down even more. So at the moment, my focus and target market would be 18 to 35-year-old males. I know that I can help them lose weight, all right. The way I came to that was that I was working with a few girls and stuff on the side, kind of experiment and engage in a program out for free. They were like my friends and so forth.

They were doing really well but anyone who is in the fitness industry can tell you this, that losing weight for women or girls in general is completely different than it is for guys. It's similar in theory, but it is completely different. I've had to narrow it down and say, "Okay, this is my target market. How do I dominate that space or how am I sitting, how am I going to make that the best use of my time?" What I did was I narrowed it down to 18 to 35-year-old males. I'm an online fitness consultancy with a very personal touch.

Basically meaning that there will always be a human on the other end of the chat menu or the way we communicate or if someone wants to email, there will always be someone on the other end of it because that was something that kept me going when I lost my journey was there was always someone on the other end that was there to actually help and not just sell you a three-month program that one size fits all sort of thing, but there was someone there that was walking the journey with me, right? If I was struggling, if I had bad days, which inevitably happens in any weight loss, but if I had a bad day, there was someone there on the other end. A big passion of mine is to have that personal touch.

At the moment when someone goes online, they will see that there is a two-plan, I have a subscription based model and then I have a three-month model that I work with people includes a monthly check-in with me currently being the primary fitness consultant. Kind of like what we're doing right now, I will call them up or by Skype. We will chat for 20 minutes to half an hour and just see where they're at because I've created my own sort of version of a scorecard. We kind of reviewed that with them every month to see how they're doing, are they on track, are there any hiccups, is there anything we can help with sort of thing. Just to keep them going because I feel the two main things that if you're out there, you want to lose weight.

The only two things you need is accountability and a clear goal. Those are the two things that kept driving me a lot. I actually did a very funny challenge for my one specifically, like I didn't cut my hair until I had abs. I made it public on like Facebook and stuff with all my friends. You can imagine 20 months of hair growth, it was almost to my shoulders.

Dean: Wow, wow.

Milan: Yeah. The people knew that if I still had hair, I still haven't achieved my goal. So the accountability factor there is something you really help with is that we actually utilize a development app to help people stay up to date and kind of prompt them, hey are you guys checking in? Are you checking in sort of thing every week to make sure that they're on track, and so that they know there is someone there that's looking out and basically having them check in every week. So yeah, that's kind of where I am in terms of who I am as a company, and yeah.

Dean: What kind of results do you deliver for people in that 90 days let's say?

Milan: Okay, let's read through the year.

Dean: So it's a three months' program, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: That you choose, that you work with people. So they're going to choose to work with you for three months. They're going to talk to you once a month. What else is involved in that?

Milan: Cool. So yeah, good, yes, good. Basically, they'll chat with me once a month. I'd work them out a custom workout plan, like basically according to their size, age, body type, etc. etc. So it's custom-made completely to who they are. We go through the whole process together. I see them once a month. Typically, it's in range. It all varies, obviously it's very variable. Although everyone so far is within that age group and so forth have given in some great results that people have been working with is because I think and I've actually almost found that I've almost micro-managed people too much.

I've always been like, "Hey, have you checked in? Have you checked in?" Where they're actually just losing weight, they're going on by themselves which is great. But in that whole process, in the three months, so basically I was checking with them every month. We review their scorecard, see that they're on track. I've seen just positive results overall. But it does fluctuate a little bit. So if someone for instance is 300 pounds, they'll be losing a lot more than someone who is 185 pounds, if I put it that way. You know what I mean?

Dean: Yes.

Milan: The weight loss ratio weight difference. Everyone's goals will be a little bit different. I'm working with someone who wants to see abs but they only need to lose about 15 pounds.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: I've got someone else who's kind of like a dad. He's got like a day to day job and stuff. So he needs to lose 30 or 40 pounds. So it's a different program, it's a different timeline. It's very different for both clients. Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. We observed one time that there are only two weight loss ads. That the only two ads you see are the people going fully clothed from big clothes to look at these small jeans now that I'm fitting in.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dean: Or look at me in my old pants kind of things.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: They go from big to what we would say, I don't know that normal is the right word or smaller, lost that size.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dean: Then the other weight loss ad is the slightly overweight muffin top girl in the bikini getting abs, getting ripped, and the same thing with the guy. Those are the only two ads but you got to know, you never see one of somebody going from fully clothed 300 pounds to abs the next picture.

Milan: Yes, yeah.

Dean: As the before.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: It's interesting that that's where your psychology too is, right?

Milan: Yeah. I think that it is-

Dean: The goal. Yeah.

Milan: Because I think this guy in the moment, once you realize that you can change your lifestyle rather than a quick fix, right, once you grasp that, I think you can just go get what you want.

Dean: Right.

Milan: In terms of body loss. So I'm very excited, that's why I started this whole thing, to really help people realize that. There is potential to that.

Dean: Yeah. Do you work with people all over or are you working with people in New Zealand or New Zealand and Australia or what's your geographically?

Milan: Yeah, I think at the moment, it's pretty much New Zealand based. However, because it's so flexible, I thought that with scalability in mind, is that it can jump across the ditch.

Dean: To your model, where-

Milan: To the USA, yeah, the whole model is both with scalability in mind, that once I've completely figured it out here, I'll jump it across the ditch and then jumping again to the states and so forth. So that we have that kind of way to get people actually across the world and help people across the world because my dream is to provide an avenue for everyone in New Zealand, guy, girl, basically anyone to lose weight.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: The long version of it is to really provide the tools for anyone in the world to come to Kingdom Fitness and say, "Hey, well, I need to lose weight. Wow, they've got these online courses. They've actually got professional coaches all over the world that I can see, that I can help." My vision is like very big, but I'm a firm believer that if your vision doesn't scare you, you're not doing it right.

Dean: Right.

Milan: I think I'm super excited to get it really, striving doing super well in New Zealand and then expanding from there. So yeah, I'm very pumped about it.

Dean: What's the population of New Zealand?

Milan: I don't know, 4.5 million people here. So it's tiny compared to the US.

Dean: Do you have, is it very similar to the US with obesity rates.

Milan: Very much so actually, very much so. I believe that, can't remember off the top of my head, but yeah, obesity itself is a serious problem in New Zealand, a very serious problem. So there's definitely a market for it, if I can put it that way.

Dean: Yeah, right. So you start to think about that if you think about how many to 18 to 35-year-olds there are in New Zealand that are obese or need to lose weight. There is a pretty big market for that.

Milan: Definitely.

Dean: Okay. Do you think that it, is there any personal physical proximity, being close to anybody or is it all online?

Milan: Yeah. At the moment, it will be all online and very much, yeah, that way. Which I found real interesting that at the start, my question was going to be, "Am I going to need to be involved a lot more in terms of actually going to show someone how to exercise and stuff, and so forth, and so forth?"

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Which again, like I said, it's real funny, Dean. Once you help someone in the right direction in terms of adjusting them to a certain degree, just a little bit more, people are amazing. They actually adapt so quickly so that once you put them in the right track, they're so knowledgeable. They're so great. They just keep going. All my clients, I just had to adjust them slightly. They check in with me every week or two weeks or whatever and they say, "I'm just losing all this weight. I'm doing well," because at the start, when you think about weight loss, it's this big void, this big black hole sort of thing. They don't understand how it's going to work, versus it's actually a lot easier than people think. You just need a little bit of course correction and people on their way. It's all online. I do believe that that is all that's needed. You just need someone at the end of the line there to keep you going I believe.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Are you documenting all of your client work, all the successful people that you've helped?

Milan: 100%, yeah, 100%. So that's one of the big things I wanted to actually chat to you about. I don't know how you found success with all you know ways to find success was testimonials in terms of actual process of that because-

Dean: Well, what's more important. I want to get you out of this and I say this to everybody is to rethink your way around testimonials and start documenting what I call content-imonials where you're creating content that is just by what's happening is a testimonial. So it's not like at the end, "Tada, this is what happened. Milan's great and I really enjoyed my time with him, and I wasn't able to lose weight and now that I met Milan, then everything changed. I highly recommend Milan. Look at me." That kind of thing at the end is what a traditional thought of a testimonial would be, right? But what a content-imonial would be is for you to do a podcast like More Cheese, Less Whiskers with people who have to lose weight.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: You are walking through the process with them, documenting as you go. It would be good for both of you because for them, it's documenting and keeping on track, right?

Milan: Accountability, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. That's the ultimate thing, accountability, that people are cheering them on. It's kind of like, I would almost look at creating like the environment of a reality radio show or something or a video, however you do it to, yeah, document the process so people are encouraged by it.

Milan: Wow, that's interesting thought. I would apply it.

Dean: That way, yeah, that way you are encouraging people and they're seeing progress, and there's proofs. In 90 days, if you start looking at that there is people in the audience listening, they're listening or watching this and showing up on the radar, and then there is John who was 40 pounds overweight six months ago. By checking in on the podcast kind of thing, they see that progress. They're realizing, "That could have been me," because they started out, they've been listening that long or watching that long. Meanwhile John's lost 30 pounds and I have not.

Milan: Wow, that's interesting.

Dean: Right? There's a lot of it, lot of things in that that could be helpful.

Milan: Yeah. This is where I got a record, when you said that, immediately something jumps to mind. Actually when I write someone a program, is something I call a Milestone Meal which I basically we as Kingdom Fitness, when someone reaches a certain weight threshold or it's basically toward about halfway of their goal, right, so their goal needs to be tangible and needs to be something we can measure whether it be losing a certain centimeter, losing a certain weight, getting abs, for instance, that's measurable, it can be achieved. It's something very measurable. About halfway through that process, I do something called the Milestone Meal with them where I take them out for a meal and kind of, obviously, the business' expense and we go out together. We actually go have a cheat meal almost together of their favorite foods. That's something that I can really just promote then. Right? Something that I should probably get more into perfecting I'd say almost.

Dean: That's awesome.

Milan: Cool, yeah, that's great. I love that, Dean. That's great rules because it's basically documenting the journey.

Dean: Yes. That's the thing is getting that attention because then you'll also, if you're doing it in the real reality way, you're going to notice that people are, there might be people who fall off the rails, right? Who fall out of the protocol. How you help them through that and get them back on track is going to be a valuable piece of it too.

Milan: Wow. Yeah. Never even thought about that, that's so good. Yeah. That's really good.

Dean: Because a lot of times, people want to hide their failure, I say failure but I mean hide the missteps or the-

Milan: Yeah, the falling off, yeah.

Dean: That way a testimonial at the end is like somebody starts out and then you're putting them through this black box program. Then with the ones who are successful, then you show that as a testimonial because they've already gotten the result. Right? But it's a little bit like throwing your hat over the fence, if you're putting yourself out there as someone who can help somebody lose weight and you're documenting that process as you go, it puts a lot of pressure on you to-

Milan: To perform, yeah.

Dean: To have that, to perform, right? I think that drama and that tension is what makes for compelling content.

Milan: Well, I love it. I really do, yeah. It's putting your money where your mouth is, right?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: So you're like, I can help these people. I'm a firm believe that there needs to be for instance, if I was to start the journey all over again, I was overweight or what not, I would go to a website and say, "Hey, do these guys have testimonials?" Also, what do they look like? Who are these people, something?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because you don't want to just sign up with anyone. I think this is great. This is great stuff, Dean. I love this.

Dean: That's why finding people, that's why narrowing your target market, like you have, to 18 to 35-year-olds who have 50 pounds or more to lose or 30 pounds or more to lose, something interesting that there is a difference in positioning yourself that you're not somebody who is helping somebody sculpt, to chisel the last five pounds into their Adonis body. Maybe you are, nothing wrong with that. But there is a difference between that and getting somebody from 50 pounds down to normal weight or their ideal weight.

Milan: Yeah, I think, yeah, exactly that. You're right, you're right. There is definitely a method difference but I think either way though, it's good to have that documentation going, ways to kind of capture that information. Wow. That's really cool.

Dean: But am I right that your preference is the people who have to lose 30, 40, 50 pounds.

Milan: Yeah. I'd say if I was to be honest, it'd probably the biggest draw would be people that need to lose that yeah, yeah. So I'm just looking overall, like that would be the big draw to it. Yeah, I think that would be my target market in essence. I can definitely helps someone get to abs and so forth, like you said at the last few steps. But usually people that need that, they're already journeying healthy so they're already in that kind of mindset. So 99% of people that are there already wouldn't really need help. They will just have to YouTube one video and say, "Okay. I just need to do intermittent fasting or I need to do a little bit less or I need to start calorie counting and figure out how to do that," versus someone who is not in the mindset at all kind of starting off fresh, that has nothing and going for them in terms of weight loss. They've just started off. That would be the people that I'm looking to work with. Wow, I love that. I really love that idea. That's great.

Dean: Now, your ideal prospects, you can point to. I mean, that's the thing. As somebody who has 30, 40, 50 pounds or more to lose and then where does it draw the line? I mean you lost 80 pounds. Where does it start to be a different thing? Where does it cross the line when somebody has a hundred pounds or 200, where you get into the seriously obese. Where does it, I think if you look at, if your sweet spot is that 30 to 80 pounds range.

Milan: I think you're right there, Dean, because and I'm again, a firm believer. I remember you guys, I think it was you and Joe who interviewed someone a while back. She basically said there was power in saying no to a prospect or clients and stuff. I think for me, that's very true as well in terms of not that I wouldn't want to help these people. But I think a lot of times, if you need to lose a huge amount of weight, you have to go see doctors. I think it's more suited towards that.

Dean: Yeah. I think when you get to 80 pounds, like you've lost that, that's the point where you haven't gone over the edge.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: You are right at the edge where it's now, you could still pull yourself back from 80 pounds, 50 pounds certainly, right?

Milan: I agree.

Dean: That's the thing.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. 20 pounds, that seems like too little to have to lose to make a difference.

Milan: Because I think that sweet spot like you said, because if you lose 30 to 80 pounds no matter who you are, you're going to look vastly different. You're going to look like a different human.

Dean: Yeah, yeah.

Milan: If people can see those results walking around, they'll be like, "Wow, where'd you get that done?"

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Oh yeah, I've been doing it with Kingdom Fitness sort of thing.

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's cool. That is great. That is really good stuff, I love it. Yeah, that's awesome. Just on a bit of a side note, but I feel like picking your brain on this as well, as soon as I got approached by your assistant was awesome. I was in my mind, I'm working on this course, it's like an online course for quite beginners. This is a complete online beginner course. It's in relation to Kingdom Fitness. I said to myself, I had plans to do it at the end of February etc. etc.

Then I heard you reached out and said, "Hey, I want you on the podcast." I fast-tracked that literally to that weekend. So I've now created the course and it's being edited as we speak. My thoughts on that is initially, I will be focusing on marketing that, like on Facebook and putting it on Facebook groups and stuff like that which I've done a little bit of research and stuff, so forth. I thought, is that something that you say that's a good starting point? Because that will draw people into the ecosystem I'd say, like a course, like a beginner's course almost that will kind of get people, the ball rolling for them? That's what I thought, maybe like, yeah.

Dean: Well, I think that what you really need initially is what are we starting with right now? You've got a list of your target audience? Have you got any subscribers or do you have an email list of people who are 18 to 35 who have lose 30 to 80 pounds?

Milan: Yeah. I've got basically just my client, but I don't really have an extent of like a list of actual prospects or people or the demographic of people.

Dean: Right. The prospect list is what I was saying.

Milan: Yeah. I don't really have that at the moment, exactly that. That's why I thought I would put the marketing into the course and get that information via the people who buy the course because I would be marketing it to them, that specific demographic. From there, taking them, okay, you've now done the course, which is like a low entry barrier, there would be a cost attached but it won't be like expensive, really expensive.

Dean: Right.

Milan: But now, they're in the ecosystem, they would be like, "Okay, I've started these things but now, I need a bit of extra help." Then from there, you take them on and say, "Hey, here's some more valuable information. Would you want to know a little bit more? Would you learn to know a little bit more?"

Dean: Yeah, of course.

Milan: Then kind of from there, convert them to a client. That was my thinking at least.

Dean: Yeah. Initially what you want to do is you need to build a list of people who are that age group, right, and that, and your target audience. That's where you need to be able to identify those people. Now a great way to do that is with a book. It was always the way to reach out, that's my go-to strategy for gathering the right people, right? What would be the title of the book that your ideal clients would want to have that they'd say, "That's for me?"

Milan: Yes.

Dean: That way, that way, you can give away a book to start going to the whole audience of who you're trying to attract so that you can gather that audience.

Milan: Okay. In terms of books, you mean, like the books that you're talking about, is it like a fully extensive like massive book or is it more of an e-book, like a shorter title, I don't know how to put it, like a shorter book, not long, like a student module?

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I know. That's a good question because none of that, it's not like a 250-page big full-on book. It doesn't matter. If the thing that triggers somebody wanting something is that you have a book, to me, I have a company called 90-Minute Books. What we do is write and help people publish small paperback books that are 50, 60 pages that look like a real book. But they're small enough that it looks like you could read it all in one sitting.

Milan: One sitting, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. That's the whole point. The thing that triggers people into action is that you have a book and that you've got a title that as soon as they see it, they say, "That's the book for me." When they do that, then you have to do some way for them to get it which could be a landing page or a Facebook lead ad, just push this button to get it.

Milan: Cool.

Dean: That gets you now in conversation with everybody who is looking to get that result.

Milan: Yeah. Cool. That's a good idea, I like that because just quickly, as we were talking, I just had a quick Google of the 90-Minute Book, and it just pops up.

Dean: There you go.

Milan: The 90MinuteBooks.com. Yeah. That's cool, I love that idea because a book has more, it has a bit of something to it, eh, when someone is seeing-

Dean: Well, you're an authority.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Right? You're an authority and it's revered in society that a book is something that we gather for information.

Milan: Knowledge.

Dean: Yeah, knowledge, right?

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: That's the person who writes the book, the author of the book is viewed as an authority. That's where the words, yeah, that's where that author comes from, right? That you're the authority on it. So you've written, you've got your idea around it.

Milan: Okay, I love that idea, yeah.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because then you can narrow it, even from the get-go, right?

Dean: Right.

Milan: I think the title of the book and also, what you're going to be putting in that will be immediately. Because I know you guys are strong preachers of qualifying your clients, right?

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Immediately once someone puts in their email and they see for instance as a title, "How I Lost 37 KGs or 80 Pounds by Milan Kruger," or whatever, they'd be like, "Wow, how did he do that?" Immediately you're going to be attracting the right person that's kind of saying, that's something I really am interested in. How does this work sort of thing, right?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: That's cool. I love that.

Dean: Yeah. That process there gets you in conversation with the right people, the people who have that need, right? The person who is attracted by that message.

Milan: Yes, agreed. It already immediately puts you on their radar, eh?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Then you get that, yeah. One thing I am, I'd say one of my big skillsets would be kind of systems and learning and stuff like that. I definitely would be able to capture data and the emails and the what-not for that.

Dean: Perfect.

Milan: Yeah, great. That's a great idea, Dean. I think I'll do that as one of my little projects. So I'll definitely get started off with the 90-Minute Book because initially, I was thinking of doing for my hook, like Five Plateau Breakers, right? I feel like if I personally would've gone to a website and say, "Hey, I could get a book or five tips," the book would win every time even if you don't even read the book, you'd get the book because the book is something that has value immediately in your mind, it's valuable because someone spent more time on it, you know what I mean?

Dean: Yes. Yep.

Milan: So that's cool. It's always the case of you have to dig a little bit deeper because I now have to go and actually sort out a book. But that's going to add the most valuable, value to the client.

Dean: But it's easy in a way-

Milan: The whole process, yeah.

Dean: Because you know that's why we call it the 90-Minute Book because you already know what you need to say. The way that, the fastest way to get your ideas into a digital format is by talking them.

Milan: True, wow.

Dean: It's all interview process.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: Doing 90 minutes of talking and everything else then, all the technical stuff in terms of getting it transcribed, and edited, and designing the cover, and formatting it as a book, and doing all of that stuff, that can all be done by other people, by us.

Milan: Oh wow, wow.

Dean: That's why we try and focus on the speed because most of the time, somebody decides they're going to write a book, what they often then-

Milan: It takes them like years, yeah.

Dean: Yeah, that's what they think of, they imagine that okay, I've got to clear my calendar. I've got to book a cabin in the woods.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. Tell my family I'm going to write a book and disappear from society for months and months. When the reality is, and all of that doesn't make any difference on how many people asked for your book.

Milan: Yeah, 100%, I agree. Wow, that's really cool. Wow, you just had such a way of prompting your thoughts, eh? I loved it. You just opened it up. That's great, Dean. Thank you. That's awesome advice, Dean. It's almost like you've done this before.

Dean: Exactly. But you see what we're doing here is we're making our way through the 8 Profit Activators Theory, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: We started out dialing in that you're in your during unit, you shared with me how you helped people, a 90-day program online and with monthly check-in calls. You get the result for people. That's your during unit. Now, who is that for? Profit activator one is our target audience, males in New Zealand between 18 and 35 who have 30 to 80 pounds to lose. That's a very, very crystal clear target audience, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Then profit activator two is how do we get those people to raise their hand. It's a book is the best way to get somebody to raise their hand.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: So you just got to figure out what is the right title of your book. Then once somebody raises their hand, it's only to start a conversation.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Because now, they're into profit activator three where we're going to educate and motivate them. That's where your podcast falls into place, that you're gathering this audience and then they're either ready to get help right now which you can help them with or they're not ready right now and you can continue to educate and motivate them. Then each week, in profit activator four, whenever we're sending out your ongoing communication, we need to be able to say to people, "Whenever you're ready, here's how I can help you lose up to 50 pounds."

Milan: Yeah. Wow. Cool. Yes. I had a rough outline of which is actually I'm designing all that actually today, specifically. After just talking to you now, I'm definitely going to be thinking about maybe restructuring it in a little bit and just flushing it out in different ways, yeah, if I'll put it that way. That's been interesting.

Dean: All you need to do, yeah. All you need to do is the purpose of the book is not to give... It's not a replacement for working with you, it's to share your philosophy, to share your approach.

Milan: Story almost.

Dean: To share your story, to share and give them the confidence that this is the right idea for me.

Milan: Wow, cool.

Dean: It's the precursor to working with you.

Milan: I think that's really good.

Dean: It's like the opportunity you have, the way we describe, the way we do the interviews is to imagine that you are going to be a guest on a radio show. It's a live radio show. So you bring your best to it to go for the whole hour without interruption kind of thing. We can say whatever you want. You get to do a whole presentation and everybody listening is your ideal target audience. They are your ideal prospects. Everybody listening to this radio show is between 18 and 35 and they've got 30 to 80 pounds to lose.

Milan: To lose, yeah, cool. Wow. That's really cool. That's interesting stuff. I think that's really cool. I love the book idea already because that way, you can kind of put it all into one nice package and get people to say, "Hey." Put their and up and say, "Wow, this sounds like something that I want in my life."

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's good.

Dean: It's easy to refer a book too. So when we get down, when we get down the road here, into the after unit, it's easy for people to recommend your book and say, "Hey, here's the book that started it all for me. This is what got me on the right path here."

Milan: So just kind of ties in so nicely with anything.

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Testimonials to getting people right in the door from the start, right?

Dean: Yeah. Start here, you got to read this book. You got to read this.

Milan: Yeah, that's good.

Dean: That's the start, right?

Milan: That's awesome, Dean. Yeah, I love that. That's really good stuff. Cool. That's really good. I think yes, I'm just thinking all in my mind and putting it in practical, trying to converting it, what I'm thinking of doing. So I've got it just in my head already.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Yeah, that's really good stuff. I love that part.

Dean: How many people are you working with right now that fit that description?

Milan: Probably the majority of my clients I'd probably say like because I'm still quite a start-up if I put it that way but I've got about, I'd say majority of eight or nine of them probably would be that, which doesn't sound like a lot but I mean-

Dean: But I mean, so that's your podcast.

Milan: The sweet spot, yeah.

Dean: Your podcast is to have the conversations about what's going on with them, to really talk about it philosophically.

Milan: Chat with them.

Dean: Yeah. Share, educating them.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: The reason that this podcast works and is popular is because they're real businesses. These are real people who are-

Milan: Yeah, true.

Dean: Yeah. We're having real conversation here. This doesn't feel like a podcast. It feels like you and are talking.

Milan: Yeah, chatting.

Dean: About marketing.

Milan: That's great.

Dean: Your business and that's what I'm saying about this idea. In that, that is the demonstration of what you do, like what the value of working with you.

Milan: Mm-hmm. Wow, wow.

Dean: Right?

Milan: I love it.

Dean: Like this is the demonstration of the value of working with me.

Milan: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Dean: That people after hearing week after week after week of these kinds of conversations, it gets to people. You may have had this thought that, "Boy, that would be a good idea." I wonder what Dean would say about my business.

Milan: Yeah, wow.

Dean: Right?

Milan: That's awesome.

Dean: That's what starts it. That's what we want people to do for you is I wonder what Milan would say about my situation.

Milan: Yeah. Wow, you appreciate even that conversation today.

Dean: Because everybody thinks their situation is different.

Milan: Yeah. When it's all basically a lot, it's very similar, eh, once you get into it.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: With weight loss, yeah.

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's so great. I loved it. That's awesome, Dean. That's such good stuff. Yeah, man. Wow. Just again on the side, I wanted to make sure if anyone is actually listening to this and they actually did want to, I'm going to do a shameless plug on your podcast, Dean. I have to, I have to make the best use of it.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Is that if anyone was listening, it isn't only for people on the podcast, I won't advertise it anywhere else that I'm actually doing a $15 on a $50 course right now, the one that we started off with for anyone that's listening to this. The promo code is just Dean Jackson, so just your full name. Once the course gets released within a day or two, the next few days, if you enter Dean Jackson, it'll be lifetime. You get $15 off the course immediately. If anyone wants to actually check that up, that'll be great. The link to it will be on our website as well, KFit.org.nz, so yeah, that's good. Thanks, Dean. Just wanted to hit that plug because you asked.

Dean: No, thank that-

Milan: If there is a few people listening to this that might actually be like, "Wow, maybe I could get some use from this."

Dean: Yeah. Exactly. See, what would be so much, now, what you did there, that plug for your course, your offer, the only way that you're going to get people to respond, the only people who are going to respond are people who go. The only way to get any benefit from that is to buy your $50 course. They're going to get $15 off, right? You're hoping that this podcast is going to convince people to buy, right? But what would be more valuable to you is if you had a book that you could say to people, "To get a copy of my book, just go here, and leave your name and your email address and I'll send you one." Then you get a bigger pool of people who are potentially your clients down the road. What you're doing and this is the value of thinking about Profit Activator too, thinking about compelling people rather than convincing people.

Milan: Yeah, wow.

Dean: Right? That's how you want to build your list.

Milan: Like that, yeah.

Dean: Because every time you get on a podcast on a, in New Zealand because imagine, anybody is, this is the kind of thing if you do this right, you could get on TV, on radio, on all this stuff is you start a movement to help the young men to stop obesity in its tracks before it gets unmanageable, while they're still young enough to do something about it.

Milan: Wow, yeah, wow. Yeah, this is awesome.

Dean: That's the kind of thing that you're on the right side of popular desire.

Milan: Thank you, right.

Dean: Yeah, that you're on the right path that everybody wants that. You can align yourself with that, that all of a sudden, you're the leader of that movement. That would be a, that's really a cool thing rather than just saying, "Get a discount," because then the only people you get to know are buyers, not prospects.

Milan: Yeah, that's cool. That's such a different way of thinking as well, like it really is.

Dean: Yeah. Yes.

Milan: You're basically like before the person ever meets you or even gets in conversation with you, they already know you in the sense. They're already a part of your whole world almost.

Dean: Right.

Milan: You're basically emerging them-

Dean: It's important to you, yeah, that's more valuable to you.

Milan: 100%, yeah.

Dean: That you know who is thinking about it, not that they're ready to do it yet. It's more valuable to you if you've got the opportunity to educate them.

Milan: Yeah. Cool. That's very good stuff, Dean. Thank you so much. I will want to-

Dean: Just I see your vision, I see what you got. That would be my encouragement is narrow it on that and then sing that message as loud and far as you can.

Milan: Cool, thank you so much. I appreciate it so much. Man, I was like, "Man, I know I'm going to get a lot from this," but you think you're like, "Okay. I've got such a solid plan, whatever, whatever." Now, you're like, "Man, some of it is like I need to just rethink of it all," and just say, "I can actually do so much more I could do rather than just do that.

Dean: Yes.

Milan: That's so good.

Dean: That's it.

Milan: That's good stuff. Cool.

Dean: All right, Milan.

Milan: All right. Cool. Thank you so much, Dean. Have a great time of the day.

Dean: That was awesome. Thanks.

Milan: Awesome. Talk to you again. Have a good one, eh?

Dean: Talk to you soon.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Buh-bye.

Milan: Bye.

Dean: There we have it. Another great episode. Milan's got a lot of enthusiasm. He's got, it totally fits. You see exactly how the whole plan could work together. I think he's going to have a great success with this. If you'd like to be a part of this podcast, you can easily go to Dean: Hello. Welcome to the More Cheese, Less Whiskers Podcast. My name is Dean Jackson. Today, we are talking with Milan Kruger from New Zealand. Milan is, got a very special program that he is working with helping people in New Zealand. To start, young men, 18 to 35 years old who have 30 to 80 pounds to lose. You'll see as we go through the conversation, how we arrived at that very specific articulation of a target audience.

Milan is very enthusiastic. He's got a lot of success in helping people. In fact, he was one of those, he fit his own thing. He lost 80 pounds himself. Now, he's got a real passion for helping young men in New Zealand do the same thing. We had a great conversation about the entire before unit about how to set this up, how to think about all the profit activators, how they act together to identify his audience, to get people to raise their hand, to educate and motivate them, and then to offers so that they are ready to get the help that he can provide. I think you're going to enjoy this episode.

Milan.

Milan: Ah, Dean. How are you?

Dean: I'm so good. How are you?

Milan: Very good. Thanks. Wow, what an honor, eh? This is just a dream come true.

Dean: Tell me, where are you? You're afar, aren't you? You're in New Zealand.

Milan: Yes. I am actually. It's early morning 6:00 AM where I am right now, in beautiful New Zealand, yes.

Dean: Wow. So it's 6:00 tomorrow is what it is.

Milan: Yes, yes, it's actually ahead. Yeah, it's ahead of time.

Dean: Wow. Talk about the early birds. You really are the early birds.

Milan: Yeah, I'm definitely the early bird. Hoping to catch the worm as well.

Dean: Awesome. I'm so excited, we've got a whole hour here to hatch some evil schemes and do whatever we want.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Why don't you fill us in on the whole Milan story?

Milan: Sure.

Dean: Then we can jump off from there.

Milan: Get into it. Yeah, all right. I'm happy to. Just first off, thank you so much, Dean, for just doing what you're doing here like investing time back into young entrepreneurs like myself and so forth. Honestly, I just really wanted to say that it is first of off the bat, it's like a massive honor and a privilege, like knowing the stature of you and the people you talk with, it's insane. So firstly, thank you.

Dean: Thank you so much.

Milan: No worries. Yeah, the Milan story, let's quickly run through it. So the whole reason I actually started Kingdom Fitness and anything of the nature was that I just woke up one day and I was really not happy with what I saw in the mirror in terms of my own physical body. I was frustrated basically in my own body.

Enough so that I actually started losing weight. My best friend actually coached me through it at the time. Fast forward a little bit, it took me about 20 months, lost 81 pounds. I was in the best shape of my life. To this day, I'm obviously working on it.

Dean: What was the timeline again? You lost how many pounds in how many months?

Milan: 81 pounds in 20 months.

Dean: 81 pounds in 20 months. That's great.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, thank you, no. The reason I think it's, because you hear a lot of crash diets and so forth is because I feel like a lot of people lose weight the wrong way. But long story short, I actually used that to then I was inspired by it. I listened to actually you and Joe Polish who was recommended by my best friend as well, talking about just marketing and starting up companies, just doing it. I thought to myself, what skills do I have that I know I can really help people with and inspire other people and so forth?

I actually started Kingdom Fitness. I decided that I can actually inspire people and also solve a big problem in their lives which is them not feeling good about themselves or with their body. Fast forward a little bit, I've now started it up last year, August. I've done, I've had a few clients through the door that I'm still working with actively. Yeah, I'm at the stage now where I've got a few things going on the side. I'm ready to dive into marketing properly. So yeah, it's been a very interesting great growing stage for me.

But it is also a very unknown area because I haven't done proper marketing yet which is growth, exciting for me. I see it as a big challenge. Yeah, this is where we're at now currently. Yeah.

Dean: Awesome. What was your top weight when you lost the 81 pounds?

Milan: Well, so I started off on a hundred. I'll have to quickly convert it for you.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: I started off on 125 kg to, let me do it in pounds quickly for you. That is 275 pounds.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: That's what I started off as.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Minus 81 pounds of that obviously brings it down to yeah, is where I'm around about now. Yeah.

Dean: That's awesome. So the 190s, good for you.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: What was your approach to it then?

Milan: Yeah. This is a great question actually. Thank you. The thing is when I first started, it's actually real interesting that you ask that. When I first got going with my best mate and he started, he was a very big inspiration for me to do this is that he said to me, "Milan, it's going to take you about two years to lose the weight you want to do, if you're going to do it right."

Dean: Right.

Milan: At the time, for me, because I didn't know much about it which is how a lot of people are, they don't really know until they know. I was in this reactive state of, I was very, very sad. I burst out into tears and literally went home and cried at night because I thought, "Two years of my life is so long, but looking back, that was probably some of the best two years of my life that I spent in what I did."

Dean: Well, how old were you? How old were you when you started?

Milan: I was probably about 20, yes, about 20, lost the weight when I was about, yeah, 20 all the way through to about 22.

Dean: Okay, wow. So you didn't gain the weight all of a sudden. Were you heavy all the way through?

Milan: No, yes. See, this is the thing, yes. Yes. The way I've done that is, and this is what I'm trying to push with my whole business as well is that I lost the weight through proper dieting and basically changing my lifestyle versus drinking like a quick milkshake or a quick something to lose a few pounds and then just put it back up. So I was doing it with weight training and proper dieting, through the whole thing. I suppose that's probably why you look back and you'd be like, "20 months," it is long. I mean 80 pounds is quite a lot of weight, but it's still 20 months.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: I think the thing, yeah, it was more of a slow, gradual decline that allowed me to keep the weight off as well when I actually lost it in the end.

Dean: Of course, yeah.

Milan: Yeah, doing well, I think, which is great. That's why maybe I could inspire other people to do that is why I actually started all.

Dean: It's so funny, I had a friend who years ago, maybe it's over 20 years ago now, he lost about, let's see, he got up to 235, he weighs 180 now, so he lost about-

Milan: About 50.

Dean: 50 pounds, yeah, he lost about 50 pounds.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: What he's done to keep himself at that weight for over 20 years now is he weighs himself every day.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If he is 180 or 179 or 178, green light is what he gives himself, so he could eat whatever he wants, so he wants to have dessert or have ice cream or whatever. If he's 181 or 180, 181, the yellow light, just kind of watch it. Then if he gets to 182, he's red light. He stays on red light all the way 'til he gets back 178.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: He's kept himself in that five-pound band for 20 years by having that policy. He's never going to weigh more than 182 pounds.

Milan: Wow. That sounds a lot like Tony Robbins, he does that, something similar.

Dean: That is very interesting, right?

Milan: That is very interesting.

Dean: That that's something that he never has to lose 50 pounds again. He's only got to ever lose five.

Milan: Wow. I'm actually working on something very similar which is really interesting. I'm actually trying to do that with my own body at the moment is I'm trying to do exactly that, to get to my ideal because I don't want to become a body builder or a power lifter. I just want to feel and look good. So I just want to stay within like, like you said, five pounds up and down. Sort of when you want to hit the ideal weight. So yeah, that's real interesting. I think it's a real cool approach.

Dean: Yeah. It's interesting because I think that what happens is I think when you're weighing yourself, a lot of people say, "Well, you shouldn't weigh yourself. Don't pay any attention to the scale," because they feel that might be discouraging for you. But it feels like the scale is what makes it real, is that shows your brain that you're paying attention to it I think.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If you're-

Milan: I think it keeps you honest, eh.

Dean: I think that's it. If your intention is to lose weight, that you're not going to weigh yourself every day for a week and not have lost anything, do you know what I mean?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: If that's true, then you're doing something wrong.

Milan: I think it's a real interesting one specifically. I do agree. I agree both ways. I actually have a friend who is doing the whole weight loss thing as well. He likes weighing himself every week. I spoke to him, so when I initially take on clients, I tell them to weigh themselves every month because I know how psychological the scale actually is.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: It plays on your mind. Like you mentioned, some people would weight themselves every day. That I think is unhealthy because you'd wake up every day, especially at the start, hear me out. This is when you start off.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: Because what will happen is you might do it for one week and be like, "Wow, I've lost maybe nothing." Where you need to give your body and metabolism time to adjust to what you're doing.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Then once you've done that, it starts. The weight will drop, but it's basically to keep you mentally strong. I suppose it's who you are and where you're at with your weight loss. I like to weight myself weekly as well.

Dean: What would you say is like, if you look at your, I guess most people talk about maybe losing a pound a week is about, that's the pace that you basically did, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Would you say?

Milan: I would say that's healthy. Yeah, I'd say that's healthy. Look, man, I'm very passionate about this, Dean, is that there are real bad ways to lose weight, honestly.

Dean: Yeah. Yeah.

Milan: I really do believe that. The problem is that those are the ones at the moment that are yelling the loudest, the ones that are having people flock. They lose 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 pounds in three months.

Dean: Yeah, because everybody wants to do it instantly.

Milan: Yes, exactly.

Dean: We're used to it that in every other way, you have this exponential opportunity that we're conditioned that there's an app for that. I mean literally, anything you can do online, you can push a button and have anything delivered right to your door.

Milan: I agree.

Dean: But you can't push an app to have somebody do your push-ups or eat the right food.

Milan: Yeah, exactly.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Exactly. Yeah, a lot of guys and stuff, they say it's honest work. That's why it's so hard to get the good physique is it's honest.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Yeah, that's what I'm trying to teach. I love it. Yeah, that's really good, definitely.

Dean: You can't fake a six-pack, that's true.

Milan: No, you can't. You can't. You can't fake a good body, that's right. Love it, eh. It's good stuff. I think for me, it's something very dear to my heart is to help people and inspire people to lose weight the right way and make it a lifestyle change rather than a this is going to end rather. Give them another option, like the third option if I put it that way.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because I think the big misconception is that when people go into weight loss in general is that they're like, "Okay. Now, my life is doomed to green smoothies and chicken breasts." Which is so-

Dean: Right, broccoli and chicken breasts, yeah.

Milan: Yeah, which is so far from the truth really.

Dean: Right.

Milan: Yes, of course, you're going to have to make some eating adjustments like naturally. I have a cheat meal almost weekly, that means something I can eat whatever I want, Dean. My cheat meals are legendary amongst my friends. The other day, I was forming a cheat day where I did 10,000 calories in one day. So-

Dean: Wow, that's something.

Milan: Yeah. There is definitely a third option if I put it that way. You can still enjoy your life but you can actually change it for the best. I believe so. Yeah. Really this is why I formed the company.

Dean: What's your approach then? If we say if we're describing how you work with people, let's talk about the business of what you're doing, how do you work with people? What is your during unit here? If somebody comes to you and says, "I really want to lose weight." Who are you looking for and how do you help them?

Milan: Cool. All right. Great. People I'd be looking for, this is a real interesting one as well. I hear you always talk about this as well, is that you have to really know your target market.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: When I started this off initially, I was like, because I'm a guy, I know how to lose weight for guys. I was like, okay. But even within that framework, I realized in the last month or so that there has to be, I have to narrow it down even more. So at the moment, my focus and target market would be 18 to 35-year-old males. I know that I can help them lose weight, all right. The way I came to that was that I was working with a few girls and stuff on the side, kind of experiment and engage in a program out for free. They were like my friends and so forth.

They were doing really well but anyone who is in the fitness industry can tell you this, that losing weight for women or girls in general is completely different than it is for guys. It's similar in theory, but it is completely different. I've had to narrow it down and say, "Okay, this is my target market. How do I dominate that space or how am I sitting, how am I going to make that the best use of my time?" What I did was I narrowed it down to 18 to 35-year-old males. I'm an online fitness consultancy with a very personal touch.

Basically meaning that there will always be a human on the other end of the chat menu or the way we communicate or if someone wants to email, there will always be someone on the other end of it because that was something that kept me going when I lost my journey was there was always someone on the other end that was there to actually help and not just sell you a three-month program that one size fits all sort of thing, but there was someone there that was walking the journey with me, right? If I was struggling, if I had bad days, which inevitably happens in any weight loss, but if I had a bad day, there was someone there on the other end. A big passion of mine is to have that personal touch.

At the moment when someone goes online, they will see that there is a two-plan, I have a subscription based model and then I have a three-month model that I work with people includes a monthly check-in with me currently being the primary fitness consultant. Kind of like what we're doing right now, I will call them up or by Skype. We will chat for 20 minutes to half an hour and just see where they're at because I've created my own sort of version of a scorecard. We kind of reviewed that with them every month to see how they're doing, are they on track, are there any hiccups, is there anything we can help with sort of thing. Just to keep them going because I feel the two main things that if you're out there, you want to lose weight.

The only two things you need is accountability and a clear goal. Those are the two things that kept driving me a lot. I actually did a very funny challenge for my one specifically, like I didn't cut my hair until I had abs. I made it public on like Facebook and stuff with all my friends. You can imagine 20 months of hair growth, it was almost to my shoulders.

Dean: Wow, wow.

Milan: Yeah. The people knew that if I still had hair, I still haven't achieved my goal. So the accountability factor there is something you really help with is that we actually utilize a development app to help people stay up to date and kind of prompt them, hey are you guys checking in? Are you checking in sort of thing every week to make sure that they're on track, and so that they know there is someone there that's looking out and basically having them check in every week. So yeah, that's kind of where I am in terms of who I am as a company, and yeah.

Dean: What kind of results do you deliver for people in that 90 days let's say?

Milan: Okay, let's read through the year.

Dean: So it's a three months' program, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: That you choose, that you work with people. So they're going to choose to work with you for three months. They're going to talk to you once a month. What else is involved in that?

Milan: Cool. So yeah, good, yes, good. Basically, they'll chat with me once a month. I'd work them out a custom workout plan, like basically according to their size, age, body type, etc. etc. So it's custom-made completely to who they are. We go through the whole process together. I see them once a month. Typically, it's in range. It all varies, obviously it's very variable. Although everyone so far is within that age group and so forth have given in some great results that people have been working with is because I think and I've actually almost found that I've almost micro-managed people too much.

I've always been like, "Hey, have you checked in? Have you checked in?" Where they're actually just losing weight, they're going on by themselves which is great. But in that whole process, in the three months, so basically I was checking with them every month. We review their scorecard, see that they're on track. I've seen just positive results overall. But it does fluctuate a little bit. So if someone for instance is 300 pounds, they'll be losing a lot more than someone who is 185 pounds, if I put it that way. You know what I mean?

Dean: Yes.

Milan: The weight loss ratio weight difference. Everyone's goals will be a little bit different. I'm working with someone who wants to see abs but they only need to lose about 15 pounds.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: I've got someone else who's kind of like a dad. He's got like a day to day job and stuff. So he needs to lose 30 or 40 pounds. So it's a different program, it's a different timeline. It's very different for both clients. Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. We observed one time that there are only two weight loss ads. That the only two ads you see are the people going fully clothed from big clothes to look at these small jeans now that I'm fitting in.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dean: Or look at me in my old pants kind of things.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: They go from big to what we would say, I don't know that normal is the right word or smaller, lost that size.

Milan: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dean: Then the other weight loss ad is the slightly overweight muffin top girl in the bikini getting abs, getting ripped, and the same thing with the guy. Those are the only two ads but you got to know, you never see one of somebody going from fully clothed 300 pounds to abs the next picture.

Milan: Yes, yeah.

Dean: As the before.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: It's interesting that that's where your psychology too is, right?

Milan: Yeah. I think that it is-

Dean: The goal. Yeah.

Milan: Because I think this guy in the moment, once you realize that you can change your lifestyle rather than a quick fix, right, once you grasp that, I think you can just go get what you want.

Dean: Right.

Milan: In terms of body loss. So I'm very excited, that's why I started this whole thing, to really help people realize that. There is potential to that.

Dean: Yeah. Do you work with people all over or are you working with people in New Zealand or New Zealand and Australia or what's your geographically?

Milan: Yeah, I think at the moment, it's pretty much New Zealand based. However, because it's so flexible, I thought that with scalability in mind, is that it can jump across the ditch.

Dean: To your model, where-

Milan: To the USA, yeah, the whole model is both with scalability in mind, that once I've completely figured it out here, I'll jump it across the ditch and then jumping again to the states and so forth. So that we have that kind of way to get people actually across the world and help people across the world because my dream is to provide an avenue for everyone in New Zealand, guy, girl, basically anyone to lose weight.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: The long version of it is to really provide the tools for anyone in the world to come to Kingdom Fitness and say, "Hey, well, I need to lose weight. Wow, they've got these online courses. They've actually got professional coaches all over the world that I can see, that I can help." My vision is like very big, but I'm a firm believer that if your vision doesn't scare you, you're not doing it right.

Dean: Right.

Milan: I think I'm super excited to get it really, striving doing super well in New Zealand and then expanding from there. So yeah, I'm very pumped about it.

Dean: What's the population of New Zealand?

Milan: I don't know, 4.5 million people here. So it's tiny compared to the US.

Dean: Do you have, is it very similar to the US with obesity rates.

Milan: Very much so actually, very much so. I believe that, can't remember off the top of my head, but yeah, obesity itself is a serious problem in New Zealand, a very serious problem. So there's definitely a market for it, if I can put it that way.

Dean: Yeah, right. So you start to think about that if you think about how many to 18 to 35-year-olds there are in New Zealand that are obese or need to lose weight. There is a pretty big market for that.

Milan: Definitely.

Dean: Okay. Do you think that it, is there any personal physical proximity, being close to anybody or is it all online?

Milan: Yeah. At the moment, it will be all online and very much, yeah, that way. Which I found real interesting that at the start, my question was going to be, "Am I going to need to be involved a lot more in terms of actually going to show someone how to exercise and stuff, and so forth, and so forth?"

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Which again, like I said, it's real funny, Dean. Once you help someone in the right direction in terms of adjusting them to a certain degree, just a little bit more, people are amazing. They actually adapt so quickly so that once you put them in the right track, they're so knowledgeable. They're so great. They just keep going. All my clients, I just had to adjust them slightly. They check in with me every week or two weeks or whatever and they say, "I'm just losing all this weight. I'm doing well," because at the start, when you think about weight loss, it's this big void, this big black hole sort of thing. They don't understand how it's going to work, versus it's actually a lot easier than people think. You just need a little bit of course correction and people on their way. It's all online. I do believe that that is all that's needed. You just need someone at the end of the line there to keep you going I believe.

Dean: Okay.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Are you documenting all of your client work, all the successful people that you've helped?

Milan: 100%, yeah, 100%. So that's one of the big things I wanted to actually chat to you about. I don't know how you found success with all you know ways to find success was testimonials in terms of actual process of that because-

Dean: Well, what's more important. I want to get you out of this and I say this to everybody is to rethink your way around testimonials and start documenting what I call content-imonials where you're creating content that is just by what's happening is a testimonial. So it's not like at the end, "Tada, this is what happened. Milan's great and I really enjoyed my time with him, and I wasn't able to lose weight and now that I met Milan, then everything changed. I highly recommend Milan. Look at me." That kind of thing at the end is what a traditional thought of a testimonial would be, right? But what a content-imonial would be is for you to do a podcast like More Cheese, Less Whiskers with people who have to lose weight.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: You are walking through the process with them, documenting as you go. It would be good for both of you because for them, it's documenting and keeping on track, right?

Milan: Accountability, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. That's the ultimate thing, accountability, that people are cheering them on. It's kind of like, I would almost look at creating like the environment of a reality radio show or something or a video, however you do it to, yeah, document the process so people are encouraged by it.

Milan: Wow, that's interesting thought. I would apply it.

Dean: That way, yeah, that way you are encouraging people and they're seeing progress, and there's proofs. In 90 days, if you start looking at that there is people in the audience listening, they're listening or watching this and showing up on the radar, and then there is John who was 40 pounds overweight six months ago. By checking in on the podcast kind of thing, they see that progress. They're realizing, "That could have been me," because they started out, they've been listening that long or watching that long. Meanwhile John's lost 30 pounds and I have not.

Milan: Wow, that's interesting.

Dean: Right? There's a lot of it, lot of things in that that could be helpful.

Milan: Yeah. This is where I got a record, when you said that, immediately something jumps to mind. Actually when I write someone a program, is something I call a Milestone Meal which I basically we as Kingdom Fitness, when someone reaches a certain weight threshold or it's basically toward about halfway of their goal, right, so their goal needs to be tangible and needs to be something we can measure whether it be losing a certain centimeter, losing a certain weight, getting abs, for instance, that's measurable, it can be achieved. It's something very measurable. About halfway through that process, I do something called the Milestone Meal with them where I take them out for a meal and kind of, obviously, the business' expense and we go out together. We actually go have a cheat meal almost together of their favorite foods. That's something that I can really just promote then. Right? Something that I should probably get more into perfecting I'd say almost.

Dean: That's awesome.

Milan: Cool, yeah, that's great. I love that, Dean. That's great rules because it's basically documenting the journey.

Dean: Yes. That's the thing is getting that attention because then you'll also, if you're doing it in the real reality way, you're going to notice that people are, there might be people who fall off the rails, right? Who fall out of the protocol. How you help them through that and get them back on track is going to be a valuable piece of it too.

Milan: Wow. Yeah. Never even thought about that, that's so good. Yeah. That's really good.

Dean: Because a lot of times, people want to hide their failure, I say failure but I mean hide the missteps or the-

Milan: Yeah, the falling off, yeah.

Dean: That way a testimonial at the end is like somebody starts out and then you're putting them through this black box program. Then with the ones who are successful, then you show that as a testimonial because they've already gotten the result. Right? But it's a little bit like throwing your hat over the fence, if you're putting yourself out there as someone who can help somebody lose weight and you're documenting that process as you go, it puts a lot of pressure on you to-

Milan: To perform, yeah.

Dean: To have that, to perform, right? I think that drama and that tension is what makes for compelling content.

Milan: Well, I love it. I really do, yeah. It's putting your money where your mouth is, right?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: So you're like, I can help these people. I'm a firm believe that there needs to be for instance, if I was to start the journey all over again, I was overweight or what not, I would go to a website and say, "Hey, do these guys have testimonials?" Also, what do they look like? Who are these people, something?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because you don't want to just sign up with anyone. I think this is great. This is great stuff, Dean. I love this.

Dean: That's why finding people, that's why narrowing your target market, like you have, to 18 to 35-year-olds who have 50 pounds or more to lose or 30 pounds or more to lose, something interesting that there is a difference in positioning yourself that you're not somebody who is helping somebody sculpt, to chisel the last five pounds into their Adonis body. Maybe you are, nothing wrong with that. But there is a difference between that and getting somebody from 50 pounds down to normal weight or their ideal weight.

Milan: Yeah, I think, yeah, exactly that. You're right, you're right. There is definitely a method difference but I think either way though, it's good to have that documentation going, ways to kind of capture that information. Wow. That's really cool.

Dean: But am I right that your preference is the people who have to lose 30, 40, 50 pounds.

Milan: Yeah. I'd say if I was to be honest, it'd probably the biggest draw would be people that need to lose that yeah, yeah. So I'm just looking overall, like that would be the big draw to it. Yeah, I think that would be my target market in essence. I can definitely helps someone get to abs and so forth, like you said at the last few steps. But usually people that need that, they're already journeying healthy so they're already in that kind of mindset. So 99% of people that are there already wouldn't really need help. They will just have to YouTube one video and say, "Okay. I just need to do intermittent fasting or I need to do a little bit less or I need to start calorie counting and figure out how to do that," versus someone who is not in the mindset at all kind of starting off fresh, that has nothing and going for them in terms of weight loss. They've just started off. That would be the people that I'm looking to work with. Wow, I love that. I really love that idea. That's great.

Dean: Now, your ideal prospects, you can point to. I mean, that's the thing. As somebody who has 30, 40, 50 pounds or more to lose and then where does it draw the line? I mean you lost 80 pounds. Where does it start to be a different thing? Where does it cross the line when somebody has a hundred pounds or 200, where you get into the seriously obese. Where does it, I think if you look at, if your sweet spot is that 30 to 80 pounds range.

Milan: I think you're right there, Dean, because and I'm again, a firm believer. I remember you guys, I think it was you and Joe who interviewed someone a while back. She basically said there was power in saying no to a prospect or clients and stuff. I think for me, that's very true as well in terms of not that I wouldn't want to help these people. But I think a lot of times, if you need to lose a huge amount of weight, you have to go see doctors. I think it's more suited towards that.

Dean: Yeah. I think when you get to 80 pounds, like you've lost that, that's the point where you haven't gone over the edge.

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: You are right at the edge where it's now, you could still pull yourself back from 80 pounds, 50 pounds certainly, right?

Milan: I agree.

Dean: That's the thing.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. 20 pounds, that seems like too little to have to lose to make a difference.

Milan: Because I think that sweet spot like you said, because if you lose 30 to 80 pounds no matter who you are, you're going to look vastly different. You're going to look like a different human.

Dean: Yeah, yeah.

Milan: If people can see those results walking around, they'll be like, "Wow, where'd you get that done?"

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Oh yeah, I've been doing it with Kingdom Fitness sort of thing.

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's cool. That is great. That is really good stuff, I love it. Yeah, that's awesome. Just on a bit of a side note, but I feel like picking your brain on this as well, as soon as I got approached by your assistant was awesome. I was in my mind, I'm working on this course, it's like an online course for quite beginners. This is a complete online beginner course. It's in relation to Kingdom Fitness. I said to myself, I had plans to do it at the end of February etc. etc.

Then I heard you reached out and said, "Hey, I want you on the podcast." I fast-tracked that literally to that weekend. So I've now created the course and it's being edited as we speak. My thoughts on that is initially, I will be focusing on marketing that, like on Facebook and putting it on Facebook groups and stuff like that which I've done a little bit of research and stuff, so forth. I thought, is that something that you say that's a good starting point? Because that will draw people into the ecosystem I'd say, like a course, like a beginner's course almost that will kind of get people, the ball rolling for them? That's what I thought, maybe like, yeah.

Dean: Well, I think that what you really need initially is what are we starting with right now? You've got a list of your target audience? Have you got any subscribers or do you have an email list of people who are 18 to 35 who have lose 30 to 80 pounds?

Milan: Yeah. I've got basically just my client, but I don't really have an extent of like a list of actual prospects or people or the demographic of people.

Dean: Right. The prospect list is what I was saying.

Milan: Yeah. I don't really have that at the moment, exactly that. That's why I thought I would put the marketing into the course and get that information via the people who buy the course because I would be marketing it to them, that specific demographic. From there, taking them, okay, you've now done the course, which is like a low entry barrier, there would be a cost attached but it won't be like expensive, really expensive.

Dean: Right.

Milan: But now, they're in the ecosystem, they would be like, "Okay, I've started these things but now, I need a bit of extra help." Then from there, you take them on and say, "Hey, here's some more valuable information. Would you want to know a little bit more? Would you learn to know a little bit more?"

Dean: Yeah, of course.

Milan: Then kind of from there, convert them to a client. That was my thinking at least.

Dean: Yeah. Initially what you want to do is you need to build a list of people who are that age group, right, and that, and your target audience. That's where you need to be able to identify those people. Now a great way to do that is with a book. It was always the way to reach out, that's my go-to strategy for gathering the right people, right? What would be the title of the book that your ideal clients would want to have that they'd say, "That's for me?"

Milan: Yes.

Dean: That way, that way, you can give away a book to start going to the whole audience of who you're trying to attract so that you can gather that audience.

Milan: Okay. In terms of books, you mean, like the books that you're talking about, is it like a fully extensive like massive book or is it more of an e-book, like a shorter title, I don't know how to put it, like a shorter book, not long, like a student module?

Dean: Yeah, yeah, I know. That's a good question because none of that, it's not like a 250-page big full-on book. It doesn't matter. If the thing that triggers somebody wanting something is that you have a book, to me, I have a company called 90-Minute Books. What we do is write and help people publish small paperback books that are 50, 60 pages that look like a real book. But they're small enough that it looks like you could read it all in one sitting.

Milan: One sitting, yeah.

Dean: Yeah. That's the whole point. The thing that triggers people into action is that you have a book and that you've got a title that as soon as they see it, they say, "That's the book for me." When they do that, then you have to do some way for them to get it which could be a landing page or a Facebook lead ad, just push this button to get it.

Milan: Cool.

Dean: That gets you now in conversation with everybody who is looking to get that result.

Milan: Yeah. Cool. That's a good idea, I like that because just quickly, as we were talking, I just had a quick Google of the 90-Minute Book, and it just pops up.

Dean: There you go.

Milan: The 90MinuteBooks.com. Yeah. That's cool, I love that idea because a book has more, it has a bit of something to it, eh, when someone is seeing-

Dean: Well, you're an authority.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Right? You're an authority and it's revered in society that a book is something that we gather for information.

Milan: Knowledge.

Dean: Yeah, knowledge, right?

Milan: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: That's the person who writes the book, the author of the book is viewed as an authority. That's where the words, yeah, that's where that author comes from, right? That you're the authority on it. So you've written, you've got your idea around it.

Milan: Okay, I love that idea, yeah.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Because then you can narrow it, even from the get-go, right?

Dean: Right.

Milan: I think the title of the book and also, what you're going to be putting in that will be immediately. Because I know you guys are strong preachers of qualifying your clients, right?

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Immediately once someone puts in their email and they see for instance as a title, "How I Lost 37 KGs or 80 Pounds by Milan Kruger," or whatever, they'd be like, "Wow, how did he do that?" Immediately you're going to be attracting the right person that's kind of saying, that's something I really am interested in. How does this work sort of thing, right?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: That's cool. I love that.

Dean: Yeah. That process there gets you in conversation with the right people, the people who have that need, right? The person who is attracted by that message.

Milan: Yes, agreed. It already immediately puts you on their radar, eh?

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Then you get that, yeah. One thing I am, I'd say one of my big skillsets would be kind of systems and learning and stuff like that. I definitely would be able to capture data and the emails and the what-not for that.

Dean: Perfect.

Milan: Yeah, great. That's a great idea, Dean. I think I'll do that as one of my little projects. So I'll definitely get started off with the 90-Minute Book because initially, I was thinking of doing for my hook, like Five Plateau Breakers, right? I feel like if I personally would've gone to a website and say, "Hey, I could get a book or five tips," the book would win every time even if you don't even read the book, you'd get the book because the book is something that has value immediately in your mind, it's valuable because someone spent more time on it, you know what I mean?

Dean: Yes. Yep.

Milan: So that's cool. It's always the case of you have to dig a little bit deeper because I now have to go and actually sort out a book. But that's going to add the most valuable, value to the client.

Dean: But it's easy in a way-

Milan: The whole process, yeah.

Dean: Because you know that's why we call it the 90-Minute Book because you already know what you need to say. The way that, the fastest way to get your ideas into a digital format is by talking them.

Milan: True, wow.

Dean: It's all interview process.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: Doing 90 minutes of talking and everything else then, all the technical stuff in terms of getting it transcribed, and edited, and designing the cover, and formatting it as a book, and doing all of that stuff, that can all be done by other people, by us.

Milan: Oh wow, wow.

Dean: That's why we try and focus on the speed because most of the time, somebody decides they're going to write a book, what they often then-

Milan: It takes them like years, yeah.

Dean: Yeah, that's what they think of, they imagine that okay, I've got to clear my calendar. I've got to book a cabin in the woods.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah. Tell my family I'm going to write a book and disappear from society for months and months. When the reality is, and all of that doesn't make any difference on how many people asked for your book.

Milan: Yeah, 100%, I agree. Wow, that's really cool. Wow, you just had such a way of prompting your thoughts, eh? I loved it. You just opened it up. That's great, Dean. Thank you. That's awesome advice, Dean. It's almost like you've done this before.

Dean: Exactly. But you see what we're doing here is we're making our way through the 8 Profit Activators Theory, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: We started out dialing in that you're in your during unit, you shared with me how you helped people, a 90-day program online and with monthly check-in calls. You get the result for people. That's your during unit. Now, who is that for? Profit activator one is our target audience, males in New Zealand between 18 and 35 who have 30 to 80 pounds to lose. That's a very, very crystal clear target audience, right?

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Then profit activator two is how do we get those people to raise their hand. It's a book is the best way to get somebody to raise their hand.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: So you just got to figure out what is the right title of your book. Then once somebody raises their hand, it's only to start a conversation.

Milan: Yes.

Dean: Because now, they're into profit activator three where we're going to educate and motivate them. That's where your podcast falls into place, that you're gathering this audience and then they're either ready to get help right now which you can help them with or they're not ready right now and you can continue to educate and motivate them. Then each week, in profit activator four, whenever we're sending out your ongoing communication, we need to be able to say to people, "Whenever you're ready, here's how I can help you lose up to 50 pounds."

Milan: Yeah. Wow. Cool. Yes. I had a rough outline of which is actually I'm designing all that actually today, specifically. After just talking to you now, I'm definitely going to be thinking about maybe restructuring it in a little bit and just flushing it out in different ways, yeah, if I'll put it that way. That's been interesting.

Dean: All you need to do, yeah. All you need to do is the purpose of the book is not to give... It's not a replacement for working with you, it's to share your philosophy, to share your approach.

Milan: Story almost.

Dean: To share your story, to share and give them the confidence that this is the right idea for me.

Milan: Wow, cool.

Dean: It's the precursor to working with you.

Milan: I think that's really good.

Dean: It's like the opportunity you have, the way we describe, the way we do the interviews is to imagine that you are going to be a guest on a radio show. It's a live radio show. So you bring your best to it to go for the whole hour without interruption kind of thing. We can say whatever you want. You get to do a whole presentation and everybody listening is your ideal target audience. They are your ideal prospects. Everybody listening to this radio show is between 18 and 35 and they've got 30 to 80 pounds to lose.

Milan: To lose, yeah, cool. Wow. That's really cool. That's interesting stuff. I think that's really cool. I love the book idea already because that way, you can kind of put it all into one nice package and get people to say, "Hey." Put their and up and say, "Wow, this sounds like something that I want in my life."

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's good.

Dean: It's easy to refer a book too. So when we get down, when we get down the road here, into the after unit, it's easy for people to recommend your book and say, "Hey, here's the book that started it all for me. This is what got me on the right path here."

Milan: So just kind of ties in so nicely with anything.

Dean: Yes.

Milan: Testimonials to getting people right in the door from the start, right?

Dean: Yeah. Start here, you got to read this book. You got to read this.

Milan: Yeah, that's good.

Dean: That's the start, right?

Milan: That's awesome, Dean. Yeah, I love that. That's really good stuff. Cool. That's really good. I think yes, I'm just thinking all in my mind and putting it in practical, trying to converting it, what I'm thinking of doing. So I've got it just in my head already.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Yeah, that's really good stuff. I love that part.

Dean: How many people are you working with right now that fit that description?

Milan: Probably the majority of my clients I'd probably say like because I'm still quite a start-up if I put it that way but I've got about, I'd say majority of eight or nine of them probably would be that, which doesn't sound like a lot but I mean-

Dean: But I mean, so that's your podcast.

Milan: The sweet spot, yeah.

Dean: Your podcast is to have the conversations about what's going on with them, to really talk about it philosophically.

Milan: Chat with them.

Dean: Yeah. Share, educating them.

Milan: Wow.

Dean: The reason that this podcast works and is popular is because they're real businesses. These are real people who are-

Milan: Yeah, true.

Dean: Yeah. We're having real conversation here. This doesn't feel like a podcast. It feels like you and are talking.

Milan: Yeah, chatting.

Dean: About marketing.

Milan: That's great.

Dean: Your business and that's what I'm saying about this idea. In that, that is the demonstration of what you do, like what the value of working with you.

Milan: Mm-hmm. Wow, wow.

Dean: Right?

Milan: I love it.

Dean: Like this is the demonstration of the value of working with me.

Milan: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Dean: That people after hearing week after week after week of these kinds of conversations, it gets to people. You may have had this thought that, "Boy, that would be a good idea." I wonder what Dean would say about my business.

Milan: Yeah, wow.

Dean: Right?

Milan: That's awesome.

Dean: That's what starts it. That's what we want people to do for you is I wonder what Milan would say about my situation.

Milan: Yeah. Wow, you appreciate even that conversation today.

Dean: Because everybody thinks their situation is different.

Milan: Yeah. When it's all basically a lot, it's very similar, eh, once you get into it.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: With weight loss, yeah.

Dean: Right.

Milan: That's so great. I loved it. That's awesome, Dean. That's such good stuff. Yeah, man. Wow. Just again on the side, I wanted to make sure if anyone is actually listening to this and they actually did want to, I'm going to do a shameless plug on your podcast, Dean. I have to, I have to make the best use of it.

Dean: Yeah.

Milan: Is that if anyone was listening, it isn't only for people on the podcast, I won't advertise it anywhere else that I'm actually doing a $15 on a $50 course right now, the one that we started off with for anyone that's listening to this. The promo code is just Dean Jackson, so just your full name. Once the course gets released within a day or two, the next few days, if you enter Dean Jackson, it'll be lifetime. You get $15 off the course immediately. If anyone wants to actually check that up, that'll be great. The link to it will be on our website as well, KFit.org.nz, so yeah, that's good. Thanks, Dean. Just wanted to hit that plug because you asked.

Dean: No, thank that-

Milan: If there is a few people listening to this that might actually be like, "Wow, maybe I could get some use from this."

Dean: Yeah. Exactly. See, what would be so much, now, what you did there, that plug for your course, your offer, the only way that you're going to get people to respond, the only people who are going to respond are people who go. The only way to get any benefit from that is to buy your $50 course. They're going to get $15 off, right? You're hoping that this podcast is going to convince people to buy, right? But what would be more valuable to you is if you had a book that you could say to people, "To get a copy of my book, just go here, and leave your name and your email address and I'll send you one." Then you get a bigger pool of people who are potentially your clients down the road. What you're doing and this is the value of thinking about Profit Activator too, thinking about compelling people rather than convincing people.

Milan: Yeah, wow.

Dean: Right? That's how you want to build your list.

Milan: Like that, yeah.

Dean: Because every time you get on a podcast on a, in New Zealand because imagine, anybody is, this is the kind of thing if you do this right, you could get on TV, on radio, on all this stuff is you start a movement to help the young men to stop obesity in its tracks before it gets unmanageable, while they're still young enough to do something about it.

Milan: Wow, yeah, wow. Yeah, this is awesome.

Dean: That's the kind of thing that you're on the right side of popular desire.

Milan: Thank you, right.

Dean: Yeah, that you're on the right path that everybody wants that. You can align yourself with that, that all of a sudden, you're the leader of that movement. That would be a, that's really a cool thing rather than just saying, "Get a discount," because then the only people you get to know are buyers, not prospects.

Milan: Yeah, that's cool. That's such a different way of thinking as well, like it really is.

Dean: Yeah. Yes.

Milan: You're basically like before the person ever meets you or even gets in conversation with you, they already know you in the sense. They're already a part of your whole world almost.

Dean: Right.

Milan: You're basically emerging them-

Dean: It's important to you, yeah, that's more valuable to you.

Milan: 100%, yeah.

Dean: That you know who is thinking about it, not that they're ready to do it yet. It's more valuable to you if you've got the opportunity to educate them.

Milan: Yeah. Cool. That's very good stuff, Dean. Thank you so much. I will want to-

Dean: Just I see your vision, I see what you got. That would be my encouragement is narrow it on that and then sing that message as loud and far as you can.

Milan: Cool, thank you so much. I appreciate it so much. Man, I was like, "Man, I know I'm going to get a lot from this," but you think you're like, "Okay. I've got such a solid plan, whatever, whatever." Now, you're like, "Man, some of it is like I need to just rethink of it all," and just say, "I can actually do so much more I could do rather than just do that.

Dean: Yes.

Milan: That's so good.

Dean: That's it.

Milan: That's good stuff. Cool.

Dean: All right, Milan.

Milan: All right. Cool. Thank you so much, Dean. Have a great time of the day.

Dean: That was awesome. Thanks.

Milan: Awesome. Talk to you again. Have a good one, eh?

Dean: Talk to you soon.

Milan: Yeah.

Dean: Buh-bye.

Milan: Bye.

Dean: There we have it. Another great episode. Milan's got a lot of enthusiasm. He's got, it totally fits. You see exactly how the whole plan could work together. I think he's going to have a great success with this. If you'd like to be a part of this podcast, you can easily go to MoreCheeseLessWhiskers.com. You can download a copy of the More Cheese, Less Whiskers book. If you'd like to be a guest, just click on the be a guest link and we can get together and hatch some evil schemes for you.

If you want to see how the 8 Profit Activators are either growing or slowing your business right now, you can go to ProfitActivatorScore.com and try our online scorecard. It takes you through each of the eight Profit Activators, shows you exactly where the biggest opportunities are in your business and gives you a real insight and awareness into where you actually stand. Try that out and then let me know how it goes for you. You can download a copy of the More Cheese, Less Whiskers book. If you'd like to be a guest, just click on the be a guest link and we can get together and hatch some evil schemes for you.

If you want to see how the 8 Profit Activators are either growing or slowing your business right now, you can go to ProfitActivatorScore.com and try our online scorecard. It takes you through each of the eight Profit Activators, shows you exactly where the biggest opportunities are in your business and gives you a real insight and awareness into where you actually stand. Try that out and then let me know how it goes for you.