Today on the More Cheese, Less Whiskers podcast we're talking with Matthew Coast, and Matthew has a company, a website with tools, programs and coaching, to help women find the man of their dreams. The one who will love them, treat them like a queen. The one who will think about them above all others.

He's really has a dream-come-true scenario for women who want to be in a relationship with ‘the one’ right guy.

He has a big list of women who are eager to hear their information, so we talked a lot about how to connect all the help they can give these women, in a way that makes it easy for them to get started.

We talked a lot about continuity programs, email, super signatures, and scorecards, all about starting conversations and getting people engaged.

And all of it transfers to anyone else in a similar situation; where you have information that can help a specific group of people get a very specific result.

So every time you hear us talk about dating or hear about women, you can insert your situation, the kind of people you work with, and the kind of help you offer as a coach or information provider.

That's what I love about this and all of the things we talk about. This principle centered approach applies across all kinds of different industries.

You're really gonna enjoy this episode. Matthew's great, and I'm sure we'll have a great follow up to see everything he's implemented.

Show Links:
ProfitActivatorScore.com
BreakthroughDNA.com
EmailMastery.com

Want to be a guest on the show? Simply follow the 'Be a Guest' link on the left & I'll be in touch.

Download a free copy of the Breakthrough DNA book all about the 8 Profit Activators we talk about here on More Cheese, Less Whiskers...

 

Transcript - More Cheese Less Whiskers 145

 

Dean: Matthew Coast.

Matthew: Hey, Dean. How's it going?

Dean: I'm good. How are you?

Matthew: I'm doing great. I'm doing great. Thanks for having me here.

Dean: Well, this is all very exciting. We get the whole hour here. We're recording right now. Why don't we start with telling everybody the story so far, and then we can jump off from there?

Matthew: Okay, sure. Yeah, I own a dating company. We help women attract the right guy and we started out actually doing coaching and then we kind of moved into lower-end products, and now we sell lots of low-end products to help them attract and keep a guy that they want to have in their lives. I have a team of coaches now. We've gotten pretty big. I've got a team of coaches that helps me with everything that we're doing, and what I'd like to really start kind of focusing on more now is moving back into the coaching realm and doing a lot more coaching.

I thought maybe you could help me kind of figure out what we're doing here with that. What we did before that didn't work. I mean, it worked to some degree, but we decided to switch was that we were doing kind of like this phone sales thing where we would get people on the phone and we'd talk to them and the problem with it was that we were getting just tons and tons and tons of leads and a lot of them weren't really qualified well enough.

Our coach, who is doing the sales calls, she ended up just getting overwhelmed with calls and I want her to focus on what she's really good at, which is the coaching, and so we switched it over and we put everything up front where we're just like, "Hey, this is what is in it. The only way to get into our coaching program is to pay this deposit and get on the phone with somebody and talk to them", I mean, it's great. With that it's great because all of a sudden it's like 75% of the people that get on the phone end up in our program, but it reduced the number of people.

Dean: Yeah, imagine that.

Matthew: That are actually in our program way, way down. Yeah, well, I travel a lot and so right at the moment, I'm unable to really get on the phone with a lot of people, so I'm just working on like if we could do an email way to do this and kind of like, I don't know, figure all of this stuff out in a way where we're kind of in the middle here. I actually just hired a new salesperson and, I don't know, we're probably gonna start giving him some people to talk to here in this next week. I don't know. I'd like to just kind of talk to you about what you think about all of this and how we can kind of get to the middle ground where we're not wasting his time and we're helping a lot more people. Getting a lot more people into our program.

Dean: I mean, what's really interesting is I've been in this. That world since the beginning, of the periphery of it kind of thing with Eben Pagan, Do you know Eben? David DeAngelo?

Matthew: Yeah, yeah. I'm familiar. I think I used to watch a lot of his stuff.

Dean: Yeah, that's what I mean.

Matthew: Page for him?

Dean: That's the thing is, I mean, I've been around this world since the beginning. Online I mean. There's been people helping people with dating forever, but I mean online world. Double Your Dating was a huge success, and then we did another one called Catch Him and Keep Him with Christian Carter, and that was out of the same. Double Your Dating was for men, Catch Him and Keep Him was for women. Have you seen all of that? You must have seen that stuff by-

Matthew: Oh yeah, oh yeah. I'm very familiar with Christian Carter's stuff and all that. Yeah.

Dean: Okay. Same kind of model in a way. What drives it all, of course, is the list, you know? You've got the people. Now, you've been doing this for long enough that you have already some assets in place in terms of you've got a list of people. How many women do you have right now?

Matthew: Our email list size is around 200,000 right now.

Dean: Okay, yeah, so you got plenty. How old is that? How old is the oldest?

Matthew: How old is the oldest what?

Dean: Subscriber. Like, not age, but I mean how long have you been building that list?

Matthew: Well, we've been building it for how long. That's a really good question. I'm not sure exactly how long.

Dean: I mean, is it one year? Five years? 10 years?

Matthew: Yeah, I mean, we've been building the list for about five years now.

Dean: Five years?

Matthew: Yeah, five to six years. Yeah.

Dean: Okay, great. Is it mostly weighted this side of that five years? Or early on?

Matthew: Go back about a year and a half ago, our email list was around 20,000 email subscribers.

Dean: Okay, so you've built it mostly in the last 18 months, then.

Matthew: Yep.

Dean: Perfect. Okay, good. The good news is that you've got a fairly recent list and that's an asset. What is the appeal that got them to subscribe in the first place? What did they opt in for?

Matthew: Yeah, so we have a bunch of different lead magnets. I'd say we have this one that gets most of the people in and it's kind of like this 40 flirty text messages that you can send a guy to like connect with him and connect with his heart. Yeah.

Dean: 40 flirty text messages. I love it. Okay, and that's good because there's the thing that when you tap into something that's compelling and feels like there's some real cheese here, and we talk about that, more cheese, less whiskers, that that's a hundred percent cheese. That's something that they're going to find value in. It's almost that they get blinded to the fact that there's any commercial intention beyond that, right? They're just seeing that, "Oh yeah, I want that", and they opt in. I bet that you get a pretty great opt-in rate. Do you know what it costs you to get a lead with that?

Matthew: It depends on the source. We do a lot of advertising, and it usually costs anywhere between 35 cents to about $1.30.

Dean: Yeah, that's amazing.

Matthew: Resource. Yeah.

Dean: You're generating these leads for a dollar or so. This is a lesson for anybody listening to this that it's a hundred percent cheese. It's so great. 40 flirty text messages. I mean, congratulations, because that's great.

Matthew: Thank you.

Dean: The cool thing. Now, what it also sets up iswhen they opt in, are they leaving name, email, and phone number? Or are they just leaving name, email, or just email?

Matthew: We're just going with the email.

Dean: Okay. Have you tested name as well? The reason I ask that is that in all the tests that we've done, it's such an incremental decrease in people who will leave their name and email that the value of having the name outweighs the slight marginal increase in people who'll leave their email if it's just email, so I would test that for you because this is gonna be when you sparingly use their name for personalized messages in a way that is as if it's a real personal message. That's far more valuable that not having the name, so I would experiment with that.

Matthew: Okay, cool.

Dean: Now-

Matthew: Absolutely.

Dean: Then on the other end of this, give me a sense of what the range of solutions that you have are and what that might cost.

Matthew: Okay, so we have a wide range. We sell about 24 different programs right now, and it ranges from anything where you can get our program that we're moving mostly to now is this continuity program that I sell where it's kind of a 14-day free trial at the beginning, and then it's $37 per month if you stay in the program, and then we have a whole bunch of other programs where it ranges anywhere from $7 to $97, depending on which one you purchase.

Dean: Those are single-purchase ones?

Matthew: Yes, all of those are single purchase.

Dean: Okay, and on the continuity one, Is it being access to all of the programs? How does that work?

Matthew: No, it's its own separate thing. The continuity one is they join and then we have kind of a few different offers that we give inside the continuity for which ones they're kind of most interested in developing and I kind of look at it like a holistic thing. Some of the other programs are like, "Fix this one thing", or, "Learn how to talk to a guy", or something like that, whereas the continuity one is like we built that specifically because we wanted to help more women who couldn't afford to get into a higher end coaching program. We have a lot more elements of what they actually need in that program.

Dean: Okay, and how much was that again?

Matthew: The continuity is a 14-day free trial with a $37 monthly fee.

Dean: 37 a month. Okay, yeah. Is it a opt-in free trial? Or opt-out free trial?

Matthew: It's an opt-in free trial.

Dean: Okay, so no credit card required?

Matthew: Oh, no, no, no. You do need a credit card.

Dean: Okay, that's what I meant.

Matthew: Okay, yeah, yeah. I didn't understand that.

Dean: You give your credit card and you opt out.

Matthew: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: Of continuing versus not giving your credit card and opting into starting.

Matthew: Okay, okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. You have to give your credit card, though.

Dean: Okay, perfect. What's your conversion rate on the trials to paid?

Matthew: That's a good question. It's not very good. I can tell you that. It's really, really low, but I don't know. It still kind of works with all the numbers, but I don't know exactly what the percentage is.

Dean: I gotcha. Is it one dollar trial?

Matthew: No, it's completely free.

Dean: It is free, but you have to put in your credit card info?

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: Okay. I gotcha. Okay. Have you tested the other way?

Matthew: Where you don't have to put in the credit card?

Dean: Yeah.

Matthew: No, I've never tested that.

Dean: Okay. It might be an interesting thing to test to see Just because here's the interesting thing is that you may end up with a higher net conversion on the end of it because you'll get so many more people to take the trial, right? The difference between free and with no credit card and free with a credit card is incredible. I mean, it's a huge difference in the number of people that will take that trial. If you kind of position that in your mind that you look at that as what is sustainable that people are happy and joyful to stay in for $37 a month for a long time? Or is it something that people come in and they stay for two or three months and they're gone?

Matthew: It depends. I mean, we definitely have people that have been in our continuity program for over a year now, so I know that there are people that feel like it's really, really valuable to them.

Dean: Perfect.

Matthew: But there's definitely people that just jump in there and they're like, "Hey, it's free. I'm gonna get everything I can out of it and then leave", so I don't really know. That's obviously the biggest thing that I think about when it comes to this continuity program. If I was a client of mine and I wanted to really kind of figure this area of my life out, what would just maximum value be for me to be in this program? We kind of designed the program around that in mind and I know that a lot of people stay and a lot of people don't, and so I was looking at the averages a couple of weeks ago and it looks like the average is about five or six months that somebody stays. Where they get past the first payment period. Five or six months that they stay in there.

Dean: That's good to know, and so knowing those numbers, you'll be able to test a cohort of the trial. What’s very interesting is when somebody's committing to a free trial, if you think about it as the 14 day or even 21 day or the first month even as being free, that gives you an opportunity to create that 30-day experience for people that's going to really help you. Almost think about it as your sales process, but it feels like it's content because it is, right?

It feels like they're getting involved in something that the first thing that they could do in that 30 days would be to get an assessment, a self-assessment of what they actually need and want and where they're .helping them get clarity on what their goal is, what their outcome is, where they need to do. Maybe where they're going wrong right now and built out kind of the sense of the curriculum that they're going to work on of the skills that they need to develop or the things that they need to know or the methods they'd love to adopt, you know? I think it's really about that discovery type of thing in the phase.

What's your big promise overall? What is the thing that you would just get out of the way and let you do everything that you could do for them, what's the dream come true that you're providing for them?

Matthew: The dream is that they end up a relationship with a guy who loves them and cherishes them and treats them like a queen. The guy puts in effort and he cares about her, makes her a priority. Yeah, in his life and does all the things that shows that he wants to be with her from now until the end of time.

Dean: That's the outcome, that fairytale outcome that people are looking for, hoping for, and it's interesting. I mean, how much of it do you look at as outwardly focused in a way, isn't it? It's funny that they're looking for the guy who does all of these things? They think that it's somehow magically it's the guy. They just need the right guy. It's not, "I need to become the person that is those things." It elicits that response from people. "I need to find that guy". Yeah.

Matthew: Right.

Dean: It's not me. it's not me.

Matthew: Or turn the guy that I have into that guy. That's really what they want.

Dean: Yeah, that's right. The guy I have is like that, but I don't want him. I want this other one that doesn't do that. Yeah. Really interesting, isn't it? The whole dynamic is fascinating to me.

Matthew: Yeah. It's definitely fascinating. It's been a problem. When I first got into the industry, I kind of came from this background where I was doing a lot of like transformational coaching and passion and stuff, and so I was like, "Yeah, I'm gonna help you become the woman that is just irresistible to men", and it just bombed, really. I did like a Jeff Walker-style PLF launch and it just totally bombed. I went back to the drawing board and created a whole bunch of small products that I sold for $7. Just to see which ones worked and which ones didn't. All the ones that sold really well were the ones that I didn't want to sell very well because I was like I wanted them to care about becoming that woman.

Dean: What are some of the. Yeah, what are some of the top sellers? Just to give us a sense of what's on their minds?

Matthew: The top sellers back then, one was called Make Him Want You, and the other one was called How To Make Him Fall In Love With You, and now our top seller is one called The Love Frames, which is like this. Like verbal ninja voodoo stuff that kind of sets up and creates a relationship where a guy kind of behaves more in the way that she wants him to behave.

Dean: Yeah. Isn't that funny? Do you want to hear something funny is that when at the same time when we're doing Double Your Dating with Eben, the first book that Marie Forleo did was Make Every Man Want You, and that was out of the same Mastermind. I had a Mastermind group were I was helping. I figured out this book marketing online stuff when I did stopyourdivorce.com back in like 1998, so I was one of the first eBooks online.

I'd figured out all the pieces of that and then I did a course on how to write, publish, and sell a money-making eBook, and out of that came Double Your Dating and Make Every Man Want You, which was Marie Forleo's first book. That was part of the thing is the title is part of the thing of doing any book like that, is the title being compelling and outwardly focused. To say it's funny that the appeal, make him want you and make him love you and these love frames are all very compelling ideas that people kind of want immediately, right? They say, "I want that. I want that."

How much money do people typically spend with you? What's the value of a client?

Matthew: That's a good question, and it kind of depends. I mean, we have clients that buy everything that we have. We have clients that if they do buy our like high-end coaching stuff. The main package that we have with our coaching is a $3,000 package, but we also just kind of implemented a new $1500 one and a new $5,000 one. Yeah, it just really depends on who they are and what they buy. I don't have like an average number for you.

Dean: Do you ever do live events?

Matthew: No.

Dean: It's all one on one?

Matthew: Yeah, it's a hundred percent online over the phone.

Dean: Do you do them groups? Or just one on one?

Matthew: We've tried doing group coaching stuff, but people don't like that as much. Some of our lower-end stuff like our continuity program has kind of like this forum coaching thing involved in it where it's like a big forum are getting their questions answered, but we've found that people tend to not value the group coaching thing as much in our industry. I'm not sure what that's about.

Dean: I think with women it's different in that there's a real like dating pickup community, right? There's the sense of guys that are in that community and they love to hang out with each other and trade tips and go out together and all that kind of stuff, right?

Matthew: Mm-hmm.

Dean: The women, It's very different is that the women are almost want to keep this in the shadows in a way that they don't want to be associated with that they can't find a man or you know what I mean?

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: Yeah, it's a different thing.

Matthew: Yeah, I mean they tie a lot of self-esteem and value.

Dean: Yes, right.

Matthew: Their own value to this idea of their ability to have a man in their lives, and so when this. Kind of like the idea of like, "I can't get a man", is just completely devastating. I mean, it's just totally devastating.

Dean: Yes. I love it. How often do you email the list right now?

Matthew: I email every day.

Dean: Oh, you do?

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: Okay. I love it. In the mail that you do every day, is there an offer every day?

Matthew: Yeah, so we do a different offer every day, so for every month, there's a rotation and we send out an email that's like a content email, and so it's usually like a thousand-word article that they get to read, and then there's always an offer attached to that article. It's a different one every day depending on which day of the month it is.

Dean: One of the interesting things that is I think the big opportunity for you is progressing people out of this into kind of the first step forward. One of the things that I use all the time is what I call a super signature that at the end  I send out three emails a week for our list, and they're all content, they're all like an article, 3 to 500 words of just content insight. I always have the P.S. as a timely and topical offer or type of thing.

For instance, right now I've got a Breakthrough Blueprint event coming up next month in Orlando, so I might say in the P.S., "P.S., I'm getting together with a small group in Orlando for a three-day marketing Mastermind to focus on applying the 8 Profit Activators to your business. If you'd like to join us. Reply to this email. Put 'Orlando' in the subject line and I'll get you all the details."

I alternate. Every P.S. is a different offer, just like what you said on a rotation, and then below that, every single email that I send ends with "Plus, whenever you're ready, here are three ways I can help you." Or, "Four ways I can help you", and then I list things that are the next steps that people can take kind of moving forward.

Do you have a scorecard or an assessment or quiz or some kind of way that people could get some insight about themselves and you could get some insight about them?

Matthew: Yeah, I mean, we do. We have a number of different quizzes. We usually use 'em as lead magnets, but we don't really use them as like I don't normally take the data and do anything with them. With the data.

Dean: Well, this may be a valuable thing for you that the easiest thing for somebody to do is to opt in and leave their email to get 40 flirty texts that they can send, right?

Matthew: Mm-hmm.

Dean: That's a really good start. You're showing that you've got amazing opt-in rates for that. That's great. Now, where it may be advantageous for you. One of the things that I have is our Profit Activators Scorecard. I tell people to go to profitactivatorscore.com and try our Profit Activator Scorecard, which gives them an insight about their business on how The 8 Profit Activators are either growing or slowing their business right now. That's how I talk about it. They go through and it's a self-scoring test in that all the insight is in the questions or in the how the statements that they find themselves.

They give themselves a score, and this is what's kind of a unique about it, is that they give themselves a score right now, meaning, "I'm in column one, column two, column three, or column four", and basically the statements are progressing from "I'm failing in this", if you're a one, two, or three in column one, they're failing in this, or column two is that they're frustrated about this, which would be a four, a five, or six. Then column three is that they're winning. Traditionally, they feel like, "This is not a problem. I'm doing well on this", and then column four, 10, 11, 12, is a "I'm transforming in this." It's like somebody in column three may not even know that column four exists, you know?

If you took one of the things of your mindsets or one of your characteristics or traits or something that you already have I'm sure and put those out there and you got to see when people fill out that scorecard, how they rate themselves now and where they would like to be. They give two scores for each of the mindsets. They go, "Right now I'm a five, but I want to be a 12 on this." What you look for are the gaps where, for our Profit Activator Scorecard, what I look for, an ideal client for us, is someone who is Our 8 Mindsets are the 8 Profit Activators, so our ideal is someone who is in Profit Activator 1, clear on who they want to attract versus they don't have any idea or they're trying to attract everybody. That in Profit Activator 5, that they're high on able to deliver a dream-come-true result. Then, in Profit Activator 2, or 3 or 4, which is generating leads, educating and motivating and making offers, If they're low in those, we can help with that, but it's hard to help somebody market something where they're failing at delivering a dream-come-true result.

I wonder if this is there may a way that that insight that you could generate would spark the conversation towards the higher end coaching programs that you're looking at.

Matthew: Yeah, I mean, that sounds like a brilliant idea, really. Yeah, I mean, definitely. We definitely could do that. I'm thinking of a number of different ways we could probably utilize a quiz like that or something, some kind of test  Yeah, I think when you attach it. There's something magical about a scorecard that when it's a score. Natural instinct is we want to know where we score, but we also want to improve that score, and when you build it in that in the beginning they're saying, self-acknowledging, "I'm a five right now but I want to be a 12", that's indicating to you that this is somebody that wants help with this. If you can help them move from a five to a 12, they're gonna be all in.

Matthew: Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Dean: I think that's really the thing, if you kind of look through and think through, "What are the eight elements? What are the eight mindsets or the eight categories or whatever those are?" That'll be a big win for you, especially when you're having those conversations. You're coming into it knowing what they're looking for, you know?

Matthew: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Dean: They've already committed to a desire for it by telling you where they are.

Matthew: Right, and they've already taken the time to fill something out and have already committed to kind of this process and so they're looking at it and they're like, "Okay, so this will get me there." It's already giving them a path from where they are to where they want to be. They just don't necessarily know exactly how to do it or they need help with it or whatever, so yeah.

Dean: What would be one of the mindsets or one of the things that you think would be easy to fit into that format of the scoring?

Matthew: One of the things that we talk about is the concept of feminine energy. I think that might be a really good one, because a lot of women, what they do is they’re like out in their jobs and they go to work. We have a lot of successful women that come to our company and they have to kind of be in this masculine energy where they're going after things and getting stuff and making moves at their work, and then they come and they bring that energy to men and they kind of clash with men a lot of times because men are like, "Whoa. I don't know if I want to date somebody that kind of feels like I'm dating a guy or something."

Dean: They're more driven than me. Yeah, or whatever. Right.

Matthew: Right. Well, again, it can be intimidating. That's another one that we could talk about, which is kind of like attainability. It's kind of become this big thing for us which a lot of high-value women have this problem with attainability. They have so much going on that they look at 'em and they're like, "Can I even be the man in the relationship?"

Dean: Right. That kind of insight, if you really thoughtfully made the statements. All of the statements that we use. I'd recommend you. I don't know whether you've seen our Profit Activator Scorecard.

Matthew: Yep.

Dean: Oh, you have? Okay, yeah.

Matthew: I have, yeah.

Dean: Yeah, so the idea of each of the statements start out with "you". "You this", and that. They identify with the statement. That gets them. Honestly, the thing that we hear the most about the Scorecard is people get a sense of understanding exactly what they need to work on, you know? "Oh, I see this. Now that you put it that way, this is really something I need to work on." We leave people room to fill in their insights in the Scorecard, too. It's a real dialogue tool, so imagine somebody fills that out and then you can look at them, and if you're looking for specific patterns, both as a filter or as an amplifier, that we don't want to talk to the people who they rate themselves all very highly and they don't have any room for improvement or desire for improvement that you can let that go.

If they're filling out the Scorecard, they got a gap and they put in the insight that, "I really need to work on this", or they put something, a note to themselves, that is really easy to then start a dialogue with someone. You can because  the way we get it, we get the actual Scorecard that they get sent and you can respond to it and say, "Hey, Matthew, I was just looking at your Scorecard and it looks like it's smooth sailing once you find somebody to work with. What business are you in?" That's a really easy conversation to start, you know? You could maybe do that same thing with a sorting question or an engaging question that leads to those telephone conversations. You know.

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: With 200,000 people on that list, I think that the whole thing about lead conversion process is that the real thing that we're doing is we're constantly in pursuit of now, and what I mean by that is that the only two timeframes that really matter now in lead conversion are, it's either now or it's not now. That's the only two things, and that's really because whenever somebody is gonna convert, it's the moment that it's now. I don't think that we're in a situation where depending on somebody to read a sequence of messages to then on day five be ready for the offer that we're gonna make, it's like unrealistic right now I think. I want each day, each message that if they're ready now, I don't want to miss the opportunity that we can help them.

You kind of anchor this as like a safety net for somebody or a "break in case of emergency" or a "push this button" kind of thing. That's why when I very carefully phrase the super signature to say "Plus, whenever you're ready, here's four ways we can help you." That takes the pressure off of it in a way in that I'm not trying to convince you to do this. I'm gonna be here. You've seen it. I mean, I email you every day, if I'm taking your voice on this. I email you every day and I have for a year and a half. I'm here, ready and willing to help you whenever you want it. The only thing that's getting in the way of you getting the help you need is you being ready for it, right? It's responsibility, right? "Whenever you're ready, here's four ways I can help you", and then you're leading people to the next steps.

A scorecard might be one of them, or If you do a weekly webinar, weekly Q&A, or somebody could jump on or be part of, or the free trial. Those are the things that people could start each day, and then I would still use the P.S. . You've got all these other products that you could do a short P.S. with a link to that specific product. I think that might be a valuable thing, you know? It's really just about adding that super signature could be... I mean, everybody that I've done that with has had tremendous outcome with it, you know?

Matthew: Yeah, yeah. Sounds great that'd be a great idea. Yeah, I'll definitely test it out.

Dean: What other things were you hoping to kind of focus on here? I want to make sure that we can go down what you're looking for.

Matthew: Well, my biggest thing was just kind of starting these conversations and getting to a place and I think with this super signature thing, it kind of addressing this, which is getting people when they're ready, you know? Or pulling instead of we're like right now, we're just weeding out everybody and a lot of times four our coaching, our high-end coaching program, we're weeding out pretty much everybody and we're trying to get to a middle ground where we're not getting everybody to talk to our salesperson, but we're also not weeding out people that might be interested but aren't doing it because there's this block in the way that people on the internet are kind of skittish I think, and whenever they have to pull out their credit card, I think a lot of times they kind of get this thing like, "Oh, is this a scam?" Or, "What's going on here?"

I think especially for like these high-end stuff where they're not even sure what they're doing here or if it's really for them. We're just trying to figure out a bunch of puzzle pieces in front of us, and we've got like the outline kind of set up, but there's a bunch of pieces in the middle where we're like, "Okay, how does this fit in here? Where do we put this piece there in order to have just like this big system where we're just helping as many people as humanly possible and we're just making just really good money doing it?" One of my visions is like bringing in as many people that are really good, like healers and helpers and coaches as we can find to just make a bigger impact on the women that we work with.

I think I just ran off on a tangent.

Dean: No, no. I get it, but I mean, let's look at your membership program for second, then, because that's a great jumping off point, right? It's a great opportunity there. Do you have what we would call like a lead product that after the text opt in, what's the next thing that you try and get people to do?

Matthew: It depends on where they come into. If they come in from the texting product, I usually send them to a VSL that sells them on the Love Frames program, and then if they don't end up purchasing that, of if they do, what they end up going through is kind of like an indoctrination sequence where they get a sequence of videos from me just talking about a lot of the philosophies that I have around dating and relationships. Then they kind of get this series of different emails that focus on kind of some of our bigger products that we sell that are our highest-converting products that we sell. At the end of that, they get offered to join the continuity program, which I'm testing different ways to get people into the continuity program, and so I'm testing different offers with it, right?

Dean: Uh-huh.

Matthew: I created this document that is all about like how to get a guy to chase you with text messages, and so that's one of them and I found that's a pretty good way to get people into the program, but another one we've been doing is, "Get your questions answered." Like, "Do you have a question about your relationship situation?" We found that a lot of women, they just jump in and they're like, "Hey, I have these questions. Can I talk to a coach?" We give them an opportunity to talk to a coach in the continuity program itself, and so, I don't know. We're still testing things with it.

Dean: How many people do you have in the continuity program at any given time?

Matthew: Right now, let me see. We've got 135 at the moment, and yeah. That's the numbers from last month.

Dean: I gotcha.

Matthew: We had 135 last month in the program.

Dean: Okay, okay. Part of this thing in the context of 200,000 people, it's virtually nobody, right?

Matthew: Right. Yeah.

Dean: That's not even a rounding error. You have no percentage of that, right?

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: Okay. There's something up there. Another number is, how many people ever have joined it?

Matthew: Sorry.

Dean: How many people have ever paid for one month of the continuity program? Do you know? Like, that's a number. Sounds like you've got a churn problem, that they come in, if they do, if they come in and then you got a leaky bucket, because that's the thing is is that it's a low number of people that are trying it, or is it you've got a high number of people that are trying it and that nobody is staying?

Matthew: No.

Dean: Those are two different problems.

Matthew: Well, I think it's both. I think there's a problem on both sides. I think there's a problem with us getting people into the program, and I think there's a problem with us keeping people in the program.

Dean: Gotcha. I might look at having something where you have a one-time thing that people can join that is an ongoing that they become a member, but they don't have to pay beyond the one-time payment. If you say that it's people are staying for six months, so maybe it's a $199 or $299 lifetime kind of membership, that then you've got people who are now moving forward, but that number will continue to grow, right? These people, you treat them like insiders and maybe they get member pricing on all of your other products or all of the other offers that you have, but every month they're getting more premium content, you know?

Matthew: Yeah.

Dean: Do you have a podcast or do they get access to open hours or coming on live to any Q&A or anything like that?

Matthew: Not at the moment. We've been discussing it, having like a webinar that we do. I don't know how often. That's one of the discussions we're having is how often we would do kind of like a question and answer webinar where people could jump on it and talk to one of our coaches.

Dean: Well, what might be a good thing for a situation like this is to have a member podcast, where if you did something like More Cheese, Less Whiskers, that you only do for members, that if you're a member of the... Whatever your continuity thing is, your lifetime member, that one of the things that they can do is be a guest on your podcast where they get one-on-one coaching and advice just like this anonymously or first name only so it's not revealing who they are. They get to listen in as you're coaching and helping or your coach, whoever's doing it, could host it, is giving people real-time advice on this, you know?

Matthew: Yeah, yeah.

Dean: You're documenting all of the stuff. What the real value of that is that helps you create premium content that you don't have any other easy way to create premium content without having to really create more stuff, because you record those and transcribe them and pull out from it articles and other stuff. You could even from it create a monthly journal, you know?

Matthew: Yeah, yeah. Okay.

Dean: That's a really good model because it keeps people engaged that way, you know?

Matthew: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's a great idea.

Dean: It's interesting, when you're adding all that value, that it's lifetime if it's 2.99 a month or whatever, if you say that you are five months are what people are staying in, that's kind of the same thing anyway, but now you've got a growing set of attention, and the ones that maybe would stay in for less than that are gonna stay in for the longer because now that's what the thing is. That it's not nipping it, getting rid of it, and it becomes more and more valuable.

Matthew: Yep. Yeah, that's a great idea. I will implement that immediately.

Dean: I love it. I love it.

Matthew: No, it's good. It's cool because yeah, I mean, that was one of the other concerns is like it was getting on a webinar necessarily is kind of... Especially for some of our coaches, it's like, "Okay, well, you gotta do all this stuff to get on this webinar and then we have to have all of the software in place."

Dean: Yeah.

Matthew: I think doing a podcast would be a lot easier and better.

Dean: Yeah, like literally this model the way I do these, it's like I dial in, you were on the calendar, I dial in. We're recording the whole thing. I hang up and that's it for my involvement in it, but everything else that happens behind the scenes now ultimately creates all this content. That ongoing model, that's the way I do our Email Mastery program. Are you in Email Mastery?

Matthew: I am.

Dean: You are? Yes, so you know that I do two member calls a month where we're just brainstorming and working through stuff, and then we create the field reports from that, so every month there's really great content there, but it keeps getting more and more valuable because it's a one-time membership of 1500. Yeah. I think you got a lot of potential there, you know?

Matthew: Yeah. No, I think you're right. I think you're right. Absolutely.

Dean: We talked about a lot of stuff there.

Matthew: Yeah. Yep. Yep, we sure did.

Dean: What's your summary? What landed?

Matthew: Well, with this last part, I've heard about the idea of doing kind of like a one-time fee thing, and I just the way that you worded it, though, I think it kind of like stuck with me a little bit more because it's like, "Okay, yeah, we're creating these raving fans." These people that are just loving followers who they've already paid the entrance fee and there's no more for them to do other than be a part of our community and just build on it, and that's great. I love it, and that's what I want.

I want people to get the full experience and feel like they're a part of our community and feel like not only are they getting help, but they can help out other people and get more value from being deeper into our... Maybe we could even give them something else that's like special. That's another thing that's kind of coming to me right now is like... We were thinking about starting to do some physical product things and maybe sending them a t-shirt or some kind of something where they get even more feeling like they are a part of our community I think might be a good idea.

Dean: That's exactly right. That's a great thing.

Matthew: Yeah, cool.

Dean: So cool. Well, Matthew, that was fun. I think we had some great stuff.

Matthew: Yeah, thank you so much.

Dean: When you're having fun. You're very welcome.

Matthew: Yeah. No, thank you so much. I appreciate all of that. I appreciate the stuff about the scorecard. We'll implement that immediately. I'm gonna go through and implement everything that you talked about.

Dean: Well, that's great. The great thing is when you listen back to the podcast, you were probably in a trance for 80% of it, so it's you'll hear it differently because your brain goes off into like blackouts when you hear something and your mind is automatically thinking about something else, you're missing some of the stuff, so you're gonna hear a completely different conversation when you listen to it again. It's awesome.

Matthew: Cool. Cool. Can't wait.

Dean: Cool. Thanks so much.

Matthew: All right. Yeah, thank you.

Dean: Okay. I'll talk to you soon. Bye-bye.

Matthew: All right. Bye.

Dean: There we have it. That was a great episode. We got so much stuff for Matthew to take action on, and guess what? There's lots of stuff that you could take action on, too, there. I really believe that Scorecard is an amazing way to engage in a dialogue with people who have been in your world or on your list or getting your emails pretty frequently or regularly. It's a great way to engage in a dialogue, so I've been modeling this for a long time now. You can see how it works and go through it and experience it with an eye to how this might apply to you. Just go to profitactivatorscore.com, and you can go through the whole process. If you like the way that works, we can build that model exactly for you. I built that engine and the Scorecard model for helping other people do the same thing, so we've got lots of Scorecards out there, but ProfitActivatorScore.com is the perfect thing.

If you want to continue the conversation here, go to MoreCheeseLessWhiskers.com. You can download a copy of the More Cheese, Less Whiskers book, and if you'd like to be a guest on the show, just click on the "Be A Guest" link and we can talk about your business. That's it for this week. Have a great week, and I will talk to you next time.